Why I Won’t Bother To Vote this Year
Please Note – In the entire article below I did not once tell YOU not to vote if that is what YOU want to do. In fact I didn’t once tell you to personally do anything. Please consider that if you decide to comment on this article.
For those of you making a big deal about the coming elections and posting meme after meme on facebook, I have three things to say….
1. Hillary Clinton isn’t running so you are not “stopping Hillary”
2. Barack Obama isn’t running so you are not “stopping Obama”
3. If you want to know if your elections will even be in play at all visit RealClearPolitics.com there you can see with amazing accuracy the results in advance of over 90% of the elections that will take place next week. The majority of state and national level elections are already determined, your vote isn’t going to matter and neither will mine.
Please don’t insult my intelligence by telling me it is important for me to vote in elections that will be won by margins of more than 25% in most instances (that is the reality of my state and county). Even a common core student can do that math! My state Senators, state House Reps, federal Reps and my governor and Lt. Governor are all predetermined, and I don’t want any of them, nor do I want their opponents running my state or representing me in DC.
I know you dear reader do not live in Texas, but if you go to RealClearPolitics.com you will note that 10 senate seats are toss ups but if you dig deeper you will see that 7 are almost definite out of those, three are real toss ups. You will see the GOP will LIKELY take the Senate and is going to 100% keep the house. That is known, if the GOP takes the Senate rhetoric will change but the results won’t and the GOP will keep the house so that isn’t even an issue.
This election is billed as important but it is one of the least important in history. Those of you that want Obamacare repealed it won’t happen the GOP is already selling you out. Those of you that want to stop Amnesty you can’t, the GOP will give it to you in 2016-2017 and I promise you give the GOP the House, the Senate and the White House and they still won’t repeal Obamacare. The house majority leader sold you out long ago.
You are told your vote counts, it doesn’t, it won’t and it hasn’t in the lives of most adults. The winner in all these elections is the power elite, the loser is the people, this is the only constant. Voting for a third party won’t work, neither will voting for the lesser of two evils. Right now every voter is doing nothing but pissing into the wind and supporting one mafia, extortionist, traitorous, murderous family over the other.
No matter who wins this election, Ebola will still exist and still represent less of a threat to you than say too many Big Macs or slipping in the bath tub. The complete destruction of our private health care industry will continue unabated and by 2026-2030 the government will be fully running health care. By 2018 the nation will be over 21 trillion plus in debt and have over 120 TRILLION in unfunded liabilities. Our southern border will not be secure and illegals will still be handed government benefits. By the early 2020s we will likely be over 30 trillion in debt, sounds crazy but just watch it happen.
The total number of people (citizens and non citizens) on welfare and food stamps will continue to grow. The deficit will continue to remain well over 400 billion annually assuming no more bail outs and destroying the free market in order to save it interventions. If any of those occur of course it will be back into trillion dollar territory.
No matter who is in power they will tell you that ISIS which they created is a threat and use it as an excuse to take more of your liberty. They will use the same fear to continue to bomb innocent people in a part of the world that should be left the hell alone to sort out its own problems.
No matter who is in charge your constitutionally protected rights will continue to be trampled on. The NSA will continue to collect all your data and insist it is for your own protection. They will even brag about spending billions of dollars of your money to do so and showcase a massive data center larger then the US Capital building like some fine jewel you should admire.
No matter who runs the senate, the house or the white house we will continue to see common core degrade the intelligence of our children in the name of making us competitive. With techniques like taking 108 steps to solve the equation 90 divided by 18. The nation will remain on a track to have us all taxed by the mile by the year 2030 at the latest, which will result in the wholesale tracking of all motor vehicles throughout the nation.
Those of you who want me to vote and tell me how important it is that I do so will have to do better that telling me that the “lesser of two evils” is the best we can do. You will have to point to at least one place in all the things above I have just listed where my vote will have any effect on even one of them. You see I don’t care which party takes which of my rights I simply care that both parties are constantly taking my rights day and night and that half the people cheer for one tyrant and half for the other.
I know that we have been programmed to believe that we are a representative democracy in the form of a republic and that every vote counts. Well I am sorry that is a nice idea, but as grown adults should we not examine such claims with a critical eye? Should we just accept this “good citizenship programming” or might we consider the claim that the US is an Oligarchy? I have done so and I have noticed every government since 1980 when I was old enough to even pay attention followed constants.
- The size of government got bigger
- The Freedoms of every American were reduced
- The national debt grew
- The unfunded liabilities grew
- The producers were taxed at a higher rate (when total taxes were considered)
- The consumers were fed more of the national pie
- The percentage of consumers grew
- The percentage of producers fell
- The majority party always blames the minority party for not being able to get things done
- The minority party always blames the majority party for not being able to get things done
- All the power is actually wielded by those who fund politicians not the politicians themselves
- The same people that fund the republicans fund the democrats and vise verse
~
The truth is the system is rigged, it is a big club and you are not in it, and the only way out is to focus on what you can influence rather than that which you are concerned about.
So don’t worry if I ever think my vote matters and if I ever see a place where we have a real choice I will participate in it. But I won’t insult the intelligence of the average person by telling them a flat out lie. Right now your vote doesn’t count in at least 99% of every measure on every ballot from dog catcher to referendum, how you vote personally won’t matter and it isn’t going to change anything. You can be mad at me for saying so but it won’t make what I claim untrue.
I am open to being wrong about this but let me tell you what it will take. You will have to show me an election where my vote would have changed both the outcome and the result. The outcome is the winner, this you MIGHT find in some obscure election somewhere, likely where I could not have personally voted for the candidate anyway. But the truth is the result is more important!
You will have to show me where and when voting for D vs. R or R vs. D will actually change any of the 12 points I made above in any meaningful way. You will have to convince me that congressmen are not fully controlled by the party dues system.
Look I don’t want to be right about this. It doesn’t make me happy, it doesn’t make me feel smart that I know this entire political game is a lie. It doesn’t give me pleasure that our lives are run by a group of power elite and our elections are simply an illusion and a marketing campaign to get us to be happy in our modern from of serfdom.
I would love to tell you that your vote matters and real reform is possible in our current system and society. I would also love to tell you that Neverland is real and you can go there and stay young forever. I’d like to tell you the Tooth Fairy really will leave a silver dollar under your pillow in exchange for your tooth as well, but would you believe me if I did? Look just because something sounds good doesn’t make it true.
So go ahead if you really think voting matters and make your case to the world for your side of the dichotomy, write memes, make phone calls, write your reps, etc. I won’t fault you for it. It is your right.
It is also my right to vote by not voting. To state that none of the candidates are worthy of running my nation, state, county or city. To exercise my patriotism by not endorsing people I see as shills, traitors, oppressors and often killers by not granting them the honor and privilege of my vote.
Yes receiving a vote is a privilege not a right! Politicians are not entitled to votes, they are not entitled to me voting for or against them. When you question a person’s patriotism for not voting do you realize that you are saying the opposite? If I am obligated by duty to vote, then one of the people I do not want to vote for, must be entitled to my vote. Under critical examination that is a fact.
The fact that you will vote for these people and I won’t doesn’t make you a better American than me, it doesn’t mean you are more patriotic either. As a patriot I stand willing to risk my life to defend the rights of every American equally. I stand ready if needed to defend the rights of property, privacy and personal liberty of all Americans, regardless of sex, religion, sexual orientation, age or race. So as a patriot I refuse to endorse people who stand in opposition to those things. As I have yet to see a politician that isn’t for infringing on the rights and freedoms of some Americans to the benefit of other Americans, none right now are qualified for the privilege of receiving my endorsement in the form of a vote.
In short if you want me to vote, you’ll need to give me something to vote for. Voting against something that is the greater of two evils is an old movie. I am tired of watching this movie and I already know how it ends. So I have left the stale pop corn on the sticky floor and simply walked out of the dim political theater during the “coming soon” promotions. Instead of watching the choreographed nonsense I have focused on my own life and the lives of those I can help, influence and be a good example to. I will put my energy where it has an impact in reality rather then on the feel good illusions of a mass media programmed mind.
If you were going to write in a ‘message’ in lieu of a name what would it be?
None of the above
None of you are worthy of the privilege of my vote and endorsement it implies.
The only reason I voted was to say no to a local bond initiative (which would have raised property taxes with no improvement in the services offered).
Politics is a circus made dominantly of scary clowns whose primary function is to distract you from what is really going on.
Paul, if you or someone else made a 3-5 minute audio piece of “Wheaton-isms” I would empty my wallet without a second thought. Just wanted to say, its nice to see your face around here.
Every once in a while, people show me memes of the stuff I say. Pretty cool!
I think there might be a thread at permies.com with heaps of the memes that people have made.
If you wanna part with money for my stuff, there are two DVD sets, the cards (with jack’s name hidden on one card), the 32 gig jump drive (including “best of jack”) and a few other things.
http://permies.com/t/37423
If I had the time, I would listen to every episode of the TSP and write “The wit of Spirko”
One that jumps to mind when someone asked about venomous snakes and Jack’s reply was:
“There are no training wheels for venomous snakes”
Here’s the quotes/memes thread:
http://www.permies.com/t/16151/tnk/paul-quotes
Thanks Paul
Paul you misquoted yourself the right quote is only slightly different but better if I remember it right.
“Politics is a circus made dominantly of scary ass clowns whose primary function is to distract you from what is really going on.” ~Paul Wheaton
I agree and here is the subtle Spirko difference to the same quote, see if you can spot the difference
“Politics is a circus made dominantly of scary assclowns whose primary function is to distract you from what is really going on.” ~Jack Spirko
LOL, seriously there is a difference and you slight alteration from your original is quite ironic in that regard.
Here is the meme: http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/list/16151#192840
Jack, I’ve been getting emails for all the posts on this topic. I’ll browse a few.
The last presidential election was the first time ever I decided to not vote. And it was because of that that I said something in my podcast about the clowns.
Mostly I am trying really hard to be less of an angry person. And I think I am having good success – and a lot of that success comes from tuning out news and politics.
As bizarre as it sounds, I think that your comments are spot on AND the comments from some of the people that are saying nearly the opposite are spot on. If you get deeply involved in the political process you can make a positive difference. But, wow, what a tar baby! It can utterly consume ALL of your life and then you learn that you can have 30% more impact if you can just put in 10% more effort! So then you are desperately trying to drag everybody in to make an army of goodness.
Running the numbers/scenarios/strategies in my head, I came back how I can have far more impact on the path I am on now (build good things rather than being angry at bad guys). And I think the same can be said for anybody (although I must admit, I am rather biased). I think the same can be said for you. What you are doing has far more positive impact on the world than if you spent all of your time in the political trenches.
http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/list/16151#221396
Yea but did you spot the difference between my quote and your’s? Easier than finding my name in the Hugul Card.
Yes – I see the difference. A single space. I guess I just don’t remember saying it the first way. But -yes, that’s funny.
You said it on TSP, once you say something on my show, I lock it in as the way to quote you.
Oh and Paul I found a guy we can both vote for, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz_V4lRdtjo
I completely agree with the do good shit concept which is my entire point. But to do that you have to make room to laugh about things too.
Voting on local ballot issues only, not going to vote on evil… lessor or not.
agreed… I wonder if Jack will go for the constitutional amendments and local ballot issues only?
I will vote anytime I can vote for more liberty, preventing government spending or removing any law or restriction on the American people IF and only IF the measure candidate actually has a chance to win and also has a chance to loose. I am not wasting my energy not making a difference on anything any more. So even if I support something if it is either 25 points ahead or behind in the polls, I am not worried about it.
Why? Going to vote on something like that isn’t doing a duty to the nation, it isn’t making a difference, it isn’t fighting back an it isn’t making a statement. Frankly in every major event from reality singing shows to general elections people forget the person that came in second about 48 hours after the competition. Voting for the looser so that they get a few more votes makes no statement that anyone cares about and dog piling on a victory doesn’t either.
So if there is a real fight and there is a side I consider right I am in on it. If the victory is a known or if the choices are both bad I am not, that is my reality this year. So I don’t vote. If you do vote in these situations the reason you vote is for yourself, it is personal mental therapy so you “I can at least say I did ________”. Well when you actually get busy truly fighting the system and making a difference you no longer need that feeling.
Perfectly stated, Jack!
Hi Jack…I believe that the vote of itself is useless. However, I will voting for one reason. It’s to send a message. Pre election polls are always an opinion of what the public thinks. The election itself is the ultimate polling. I will and hopefully others will vote Libertarian or third party. If enough of us votes a certain way, someone may pay attention and take our freedoms away at a slower pace.
@joe zappen, if you send a message and no one cares or listens to or even receives it, have you actually sent a message?
No one cares about what percentage of the vote libertarians take and not enough Americans are libertarian minded enough to change it. When you first hear the libertarian message it is like beautiful music you want to share, you are sure everyone will love it.
The refusal to vote libertarian by most Americans doesn’t stem from “waste your vote thinking”, the refusal is most Americans are NOT libertarians when you push the issues.
Tell any average person on the street you want to cut spending by 10% and most will say, good. Then name some things we can cut and guard your throat as they try to slit it.
But Jack they told me that my vote does matter, that I have to have a four year degree to be successful, that government is helpful, that the Federal Reserve is a trustworthy institution, and that we are free to do what we want with our lives. I mean yeah we can’t sell raw milk, we can’t grow/use/sell a very useful plant, we can’t sell produce from our gardens, and god forbid if a child starts a lemonade stand without the proper permits and filing a tax return! What kind of world would this be????
P.S. if I could take my ballot and use it to wipe my 5th point of contact before putting it in the tally machine and NOT get arrested, I would!
This applies north of the 49 as well. The three major parties are terrified of proportional representation, only the Greens and Libertarians support the idea. Even if that ever works out I am not convinced much will change. The public is too wrapped up in normalcy bias to even give a little bit of a crap about their freedom.
I agree, it’s all evil but we have important local, regional, state issues on the ballot. I don’t know if it will make any difference in the long run but I still feel compelled to participate in the process. Having said that, I also live off grid, have for more than 35 years. It never made a difference that I was against setting up the thugs in the ME or selling out our economy to China or the exploitation of our natural resources or giving the financial industry carte blanche to rob, pillage and plunder or to send our best and brightest over there for cannon fodder or to decimate our Constitution. But even so, the people who supported ALL of what I think is destroying the country have only gotten more powerful and if there is anything I can do to stop it I will try. Beyond the fact that I put my money where my mouth is and live on solar, try to grow some food, practice marksmanship (etc), I can still vote for free, it doesn’t take that much time and have seen rotten politicians defeated and replaced by soon to be rotten ones. So yes, I agree with most of what you are saying but I’m not ready to roll over for the bastards quite yet. Maybe when they can take my pen from my cold, dead hands.
Jack you often say “…and you could get hit by a gravel truck on your way to work tomorrow” in reference to the ever-present risk of death inherent in being alive.
I wonder how the odds of actually swinging an election compare to those of getting crushed by a gravel truck or otherwise getting killed between your home/work and the polling place?
Good point, I think that the odds of dying in a car wreck on the way to vote is more likely than you changing the outcome of an election.
Agreed! I’ve been run over on my bike once, almost killed multiple times on my bike, or in my truck. NEVER once have I voted and changed the outcome of ANY election…
…except maybe for where a group of friends was going to eat 😉
Jack,
It’s been a pretty long and convoluted journey, but I ended up in the same place as you. Until such time as I believe my vote would be for someone who is not bent on taking more of our liberty, I decline to participate.
It’s a rare thing to see an honest man writing the truth. Thank you.
If you want to screw with their minds it’s an easy thing. Take your ballot vote for the local elections, bond issues, or other initiatives and that’s it. I cannot tell you how much it angers politicians to see “undervoting” on the top ballot races.
+1
Hold up, it’s election time???
The only reason I’ll be visiting the polls here in Tennessee is the 4 state constitutional amendments on the ballot, the most important being one changing how our judges are chosen.
And if they are in play at all, that makes a lot of sense. But will they count your ballot if you don’t vote for the others stuff, for more listen to todays show.
I think that the most localized the race or issue, the less people are interested in conducting reliable polling. For example, I just spent 10 minutes googling around for current polls on our 4 amendments and other than a mention of one by Vanderbilt PoliSci in a poorly written article, I couldn’t find one. As for undervotes, I’m fairly certain they’re supposed to count in Tennessee, but I admit I can’t find anything specific either way.
And I’m going to clarify a bit here. Voting on constitutional amendments and local ballot initiatives, assuming they are clearly written, usually present clear direction on an issue. For example, one of the amendments in Tennessee is writing into the state constitution a ban on taxation of earned income. When this is a campaign issue, you never know how your rep will vote when it really gets down to it.
And see yes that I would vote for, I would vote for almost any and all restrictions on what government can do. I don’t have such a measure to vote on, the few I would vote on are so beyond already determined it makes no sense to worry about them. But hell yes, if Texas put a measure on the ballot to forbid future tax on anything, I would go vote for it.
Glad I did not applied for citizenship here.
Reason 1- I don’t have to waste my time voting
Reason 2- I have an option of leaving and not dragging an umbilical cord of taxation with me.
Thank you Jack as always YOU ROCK!
So what do we do then? I know the answer given will be to live your life. Care for yourself, your family, your community. Got it, I agree (somewhat) I’m doing it, living it, and loving it. But then what? Taxes still go up. We are still being extracted through inflation and taxation. People are getting further and further behind. More people in the cart, less pulling it. When is enough, enough? I am going to vote this year but only voting for county commissioner and 1 Kansas constitutional amendment. I’m not calling for violent revolt or succession, but honestly what else is there to do then? At some point sentinels are going to have to do something, and are we implicit in kicking that can down to our children?
Dustin,
There is nothing for you to do, if there was it would be because the system wasn’t rigged from the beginning. The caring for yourself, family and community is what makes the difference. Less reliance on the system is what makes us free. Unfortunately, they do not care about what the people actually think or want, it is all about progressing their interests.
@dustin if every person upset by people that don’t vote picked one law and one law only that infringed on rights and got a group together to challenge in court, more laws would be repealed then will ever be repealed by voting. Even if you wish to be political there are better ways than by voting, if you want more freedom and less government and know that that really means anyway.
I’m not political in the typical sense anymore. Pretty much ancap. I still pay attention, more than I should be but I set a timer on my phone for 15 minutes and that’s it. I agree that voting is not the solution and the state is definitely not the solution. I’ve been listening to freedomainradio longer than tsp, although tsp is a better fit for my lifestyle. It just seems as if there are no solutions in the typical sense. SM always says to look at your shackles and you will be free. I agree that it is freeing but what about all the damn aholes that walk up and put more on you, every day? We can all talk about this until we are blue in the face, I’m going to go spend some time in my shop.
I agree Jack. National and large state elections are pre-determined ahead of time, and the bureaucrats and the “handlers” control most things in government anyway, and are not subject to any democratic forces.
However, local ballot initiatives and city/county offices, including the sheriff, are places where a single vote can make a difference in my everyday life. I choose to vote there.
I have taken the bull by the horns and personally, me and my wife, sat down to dinner with the sheriff candidate and his wife, and I think I have determined what kind of man he is, and I give him my support.
However, I will continue to monitor him, and if I find out he has screwed up and broken his Oath, I will oppose him just as vigorously.
Has there ever been one you voted on where the outcome wasn’t already pre determined. If so great if not they don’t matter either. We have several on our ballot this year, all are known in the polls to be passing or failing already by at least 10%.
Jack,
Thanks, I will check into the ballot initiatives’ polling. We don’t have good polling here in rural Alabama like they do in the big cities like Birmingham & Huntsville, so it might be that we don’t know.
Thanks for the perspective.
If you do NOT vote, you will have NO RIGHT to complain. Even if you write in names, you need to do it. Do you think things will EVER get changed if everyone thought like you- (Thought is giving you the benefit of the doubt). Here’s an idea, convince all of the Demokrats to “vote” like you. They TURN OUT. that’s how they WIN. The rest of us are working for a living. Think about it.
That is a non starter argument. I totally demolish it in today’s show.
As long as they continue to take my tax money, I can complain all I want, regardless of whether I vote.
@gs
I jumped off that hamster wheel a long time ago. And all that democrat/republican stuff is nonsense. Who exactly is this “they” that you speak of?
Is it the ones who want to criminalize a kid who draws a picture of a gun or giving food to the homeless, or is the ones that want to criminalize being gay and put up a ten commandments monument in the courthouse with my money? Or, is it the ones who want to shut out every other candidate from elections who’s not part of the two-party system?
Maybe it’s the ones who keep us too scared, too busy, and too in debt to notice the big bottle of Vaseline in their hand. Maybe it’s the ones that keep us in perpetual war while building a police state in the name of security. Which ones are “they?”
Until they put a “None of the Above” on the ballet I’m not interested in voting.
There isn’t a none-of-the above in Kansas, but I leave the vast majority blank except for the rare candidate that I will support or state constitutional amendments .
Do they count your ballot if you do that? District after district are now starting to not count ballots that only vote on initiatives, etc. They are discarding them as incomplete.
They do in Kansas. Not sure about elsewhere.
It’s the stuff on the ballot affecting local issues that matters most, but while I’m there I’ll check the box for ‘the lesser of two evils.’ Someone’s got to take it for the team.
Yet you can’t make any logical mathematical argument for any thing on the ballot in Texas this year can you? The winds this year are very clear. There isn’t a Vegas casino offering odds on Texas elections this year. I don’t know there may be some town council stuff here and there but as a Tarrant county resident my vote won’t matter in anyway and I don’t want either in most choices as well so there is no point for ME to vote.
The only thing on the ballot is a 2:00 AM ordinance for bars in Frisco. I don’t really care for it to pass. But for the rest, the dice have been cast.
The the only vote you want to cast this year is a vote to restrict the liberty of those who live a life you choose not to live for yourself?
I mean what prevents a bar from being open at 230 right now? A law, this vote either repeals or alters that law to weaken it. So you have a chance to weaken government and you’d prefer not to?
I guess your reason is something like, “no one needs to be out drinking that late and carrying on at all hours like that”. But is that your business? I know, I know DUI, right? Well that is already against the law, cops are on duty 24 hours a day and if bars stayed open you might actually have less not more DUIs.
This kind proves that votes do matter. If I take the approach that restricting the sale of alcohol is none of my business, should I also stay home if prostitution came on a ballot? How about gambling? Dope dispensaries? You know, the old slippery slope. None of that stuff is my business. Right? The reason I moved to Frisco is because it’s a calm, tranquil place to raise a family. And I want to keep it that way. You want booze past midnight, go home and get drunk or drive to Dallas. You want gambling and prostitution, go to Vegas. Pot, Colorado. B…B…But my property rights! News flash, your property belongs to the county and the laws governing your city. Go run your business in a more permissive city, country or state.
If all conservatives stay home because the vote doesn’t count, then we get stuck with Davis. Deep down inside, given the crappy choices we have, I’m sure you have some preference based on the lesser of two evils that you are not willing to admit because in Texas you can afford to ride the coattails of conservatives.
Do I like Abbott? I like him more than Wendy. If you ran, I’d vote for you in a heartbeat. Hell, I may just right in your name for giggles. But given what I’ve got, I’ll vote for Abbott, not expecting much, but at least he’s paid lip service to fundamental issues on life and guns that I can hold him accountable for. Can’t say the same about Wendy. As for the rest, we all have to work on expanding our personal liberty, but that by no means is mutually exclusive from participating in the political process. It’s that or quit the game and take the ball home.
Denton city is has it panties in wad because of fracking right in their backyard. I guess those folks should stay home and let the oil industry stink-up their air.
Do you realize who you are talking to?
I want all of those things made legal. Every single one of them even though many are things I would never do.
And again Davis is scum, so is Abbott, and again it doesn’t matter, you can’t find a casino in Vegas giving odds on Davis.
See why do you get in a wad that I say I WILL NOT VOTE and that I point out if I did vote likely I would vote in opposition to most everything you’d vote for, shouldn’t that make you happy?
Also you just proved how statist it is to see voting as extremely important. Thanks.
If not by voting how do you expect to elect those that govern the country? I’ll give you that the system is broken, that it’s rigged, but how do you change it without voting. Remember the old Permaculture adage: the problem is the solution? Tyrants won’t go home just because they’re made to feel disenfranchised. I haven’t listened to the next episode, perhaps there you make it clear what options come from not voting. Unlike King George’s, our political system was predicated on suffrage. Before abandoning it, well, there must be a another system of governance. Voids are always filled.
Well I talk about how to change things daily so that is my answer. But you are making a claim here Jose SO YOU DEFEND IT, how is voting going to change the system for the better right now. That is your assertion, that voting is a solution, I made my claim and I backed it with fact, logic and math. You have neither successfully challenged my claim nor made a case for your own. I have said what I have to say.
I’ll tell you this, my stance is as long as people think voting will fix things, they are saying we ourselves are not responsible for our problems. So we will continue to vote for people that reenforce that message and we will continue to vote for bigger thieves, liars and tyrants.
Your people are electing slave masters because they are happy being slaves, have I not taught you that? Have I not taught you that most people are slaves, didn’t you really like this episode. http://www.thesurvivalpodcast.com/proud-slaves
I think you did, I think it really hit you.
Okay bro so most of your fellow Americans are not ready for that message yet, who do you think they are going to elect. How are you going to get a person to vote for liberty while they polish their chains and say “but I want the D or the R as my master? They give me the stuff that I want and say everyone else is wrong.”
If you ever want an election with a real choice, you have to show people what freedom looks like, endorsing a killer, a thief, a traitor, a murderer because he is the lesser of two evils doesn’t do that.
“Make your own way and the others will follow”, what did you think that meant, vote for the R?
Couldn’t agree more. Just a few days ago I was explaining this very thing to a friend.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douche_and_Turd
Pardon the coarseness, but methinks south park did it very well.
Apathy is not the answer. Watch Michelle Malkin’s documentary “Rocky Mountain Heist,” to see what happens when a determined liberal Gang of Four turn Colorado from an economic powerhouse into a dysfunctional wasteland. Texas is next. My own state of Washington is half way there. There are polititions like Rand Paul and Ted Cruz who are worth believing in. We still have our constitution, and I will exercise my right to vote because for the moment, it is still my right. If you don’t use it, you may lose it, and my father and brothers did not serve in this country’s military for you to give away that right so willingly. Nothing will change if you sit back and do nothing.
@Karen not voting isn’t apathy. Not acting is apathy!
The people that have done the most for liberty in the last 70 years of our history didn’t do it with voting.
Apathy? You really think listening to a zealot like Malkin isn’t apathy? Seeing even good men like Paul as our solution is apathy defined! Apathy is inaction or taking meaningless actions.
You really think I don’t make a much bigger impact on the nation though my actions then I ever could by voting or even by running for office. Have you seen Defining the Machine?
Do you consider me apathetic?
If you want to influence politics, write to rich people. Better yet marry a rich person or become one. Polticians listen to rich people. The only voters politicans listen to are those who vote with big checks.
I would also say if you want to change shit politically do good things in opposition to the status quo in such a way as to make attacking them impossible.
Ron Finley isn’t rich and he didn’t get street side and guerrilla gardens approved by voting or by bribery. http://www.ted.com/talks/ron_finley_a_guerilla_gardener_in_south_central_la?language=en
If you look at the people that have done the most for freedom in the last 70 years, none did it politically. Rosa Parks didn’t vote, she refused to sit in the back seat!
Jack, I agree 100% with you on this. I don’t know about your area, but this cycle of elections there are several local offices that I will be voting on. I really don’t look much past my county leaders as any way I can have any influence with my vote. State, maybe a little. Federal level? F that. They havent been on my side since I was born, regardless of which puppet was up there. I am so far from the people that matter, the ultra ultra rich, That they dont care about me or those like me. None of them. Hillary, Obama, Ted Cruz, Rand Paul. It is all about the money.
I work, pay my taxes with a bad taste in my mouth, take care of my family, don’t abuse local services, help my neighbors when I can, teach my boys to do the same. Those fools that live about 40 miles as the crow flies from me, not worth my time.
I also have concerns about a half empty ballot not being counted, so after I vote for my local officials, I write in my grandfather’s name for the rest of them.
If you want to vote and really have a say…vote in the primaries!
@Andrew, really, well last I checked I didn’t have a say there either.
Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil.
Don’t recall where that quote came from but it has stuck with me.
Living in a communist country for the first ten years of me live, I have always believed that my involvement in government was the only way to ensure my liberty. Four years ago I even joined my local political committee, to “work for change. In the last two to three years I stumbled upon TSP and Jack ruined me. I started to see that the R or D at the end of the clown’s name did not matter, they are still loyal only to the machine, and don’t care about the citizen or our Constitution. Do I still vote? Yes, but mainly for local, county and state issuer. As for the “clown vote”, what vote? The results are in before the voting begins.
Paul, I love your writings. I agree with you on most points. However, you are making the assumption that I vote to change the outcome of the election. That is not the case. I know better . I vote for me. For much the same reason that I try to do a good deed everyday, preferably anonymously. I vote for the same reason that I tithe. I vote for the same reason that I don’t litter. I vote because it makes me feel a short, imagined bond with the founding fathers, with every one of our soldiers who offered to fight and die for this country, and with my own late father who fought in WWII. I am fully aware of the force of low information voters. I understand that there is so much voter fraud that my paltry vote is like a dust mote in a hurricane. I guess I vote for what life could be, and what it should be in my mind. I vote for my own sanity. This year I will drive for 9 hours to vote, because the post mistress in this little town where I am working returned as un-deliverable, my absentee ballot for the second election in a row. There is never any issue with the rest of my mail. I vote because I will “not go gentle into that good night”. I vote for the same reason that POWs kept their cramped cells orderly. I’m sure it is like the rat on it’s wheel, running full speed, while the cage is motionless. But I vote. At the very least, I can tell my grandchildren that I did NOT vote to enslave them with socialism.
@samnjoeysgrama, so you vote for mental therapy. There is nothing wrong with that and at least you seem to know it. Though I do have this challenge for you, since your nation is important to you, could you come up with 4-5 things you could make part of your life that would give you a real bond with those who served, a real connection to our founding fathers, not a brief imagined one. Please note that “imagined” was your word, not my word.
What if you committed to telling one person about jury nullification every week for the rest of your life. You’d likely never swing an election but odds are by doing this you would set at least one person free of a crime they should never go to prison for, at least one. Hell 52 a year for ten years is 520. Of those half would at least discuss it with 4-5 other people, that is over 2400 people that know the truth about the jury and its real role in a republic. The likelihood that at least one will serve on a jury for a unconstitutional or victimless crime is HUGE.
That is just one example. Rosa Parks didn’t vote for her rights she simply refused to sit in the back of the bus.
You say you do what you do for the same reason that POWs kept a neat cell, does that mean that may be I was right when I said it is those who vote for someone they hate that have accepted surrender? Dreaming of freedom makes one feel good, it is all a prisoner has. You though are NOT a prisoner unless you choose to be. Perhaps it is time to change from what sounds like defeatist language to victory language. I have been thinking that a show called 10 things more effective than voting a week or two from now would be a good idea.
Jury nullification is one, what else can you think of that actually makes a difference? May be you should get off the wheel. Also if you are voting for the lesser of two socialists, can you really tell your grandchildren that you, ” did NOT vote to enslave them with socialism.” I mean may be you mean that because you are voting for 3rd parties? If so I guess your statement is true, you vote for someone that can never win then. Okay, well isn’t that exactly what a person who doesn’t vote is doing? I have to actually tell my Grandson some day I DID vote for socialism, because I voted FOR Bush twice, I voted FOR Dole even though he lost. Those in fact were votes FOR socialism, I didn’t believe it at the time but I know the truth now. I know voting for ROMNEY was a vote for socialism, for McCain was a vote FOR socialism.
I am not asking you to follow my example but perhaps this helps you better understand it?
Instead of a ballot to vote people in, I’d like a ballot where we vote to eliminate (but never add) functions of and positions in federal, state, and local governments.
Never happen, but I bet that’s a ballot even Jack would mark. I know I would. It’d be all black 🙂
I vote Libertarian even though I know they have no hope of winning here, however, if they obtain a certain percentage of votes then they no longer have to use petitions to get on the ballot the next election cycle. In cases where there is no Libertarian running, I vote for whichever third party is closest to my beliefs like the Constitutional party. If there is only r and d, then I don’t vote for that office.
Bottom line is that voting is supposed to make representatives responsive to the will of the voters, but that hasn’t been true for a very long time.
When a fraction of voters drop out of the process, it doesn’t really matter to those in power because they can still play the game of saying one thing while doing the other (while they both do pretty much the same).
But, when a ton of voters drop out, turn away, and do what they want without “asking” for permission from those in power, it changes things. It gets dicey, for sure but it sends a clear signal that your “audience” has walked away from the game and made the players irrelevant.
A government that is unresponsive to the will of its voters is an abusive one and they will only get more abusive the more that they feel their existence is threatened. But that’s when things will actually begin to change. Doing the same old same old at the polls is just keeping the con going.
I am happy to say that I voted with my feet last year.
I know you also have a problem with my kind of voting, Jack, but I think you are the one making a mistake staying in the US. As the US drops in every freedom survey, my new country has risen in all those same surveys. And, it now leads the US in freedom in every survey.
I feel sad that the country I grew up in, the one I served 4 years in its military, the one were most of my immediate family lives, the one were my old friends have chosen to stay has changed for the worse. That’s bad enough, but I have to recognize that it will NEVER get better until it crashes, the government looses its grip and then its inhabitants live terrible lives for many years. No thank you.
I wish good luck to you and all your listeners. Your podcasts are worth much more than my time to listen. Thanx, Jack!
I suport that you won’t be voting, but I am going to vote, but not for any Republican or Democrat because they are already bought and paid for by PAC.s and lobbiests, the pay they receive from us taxpayers is like giving a waitress a tip! I am going to vote for third party candidates when available or write my own name in for when there isn’t a third party candidate to vote for! I think the American people should bring the Democrats and Republicans up on Anti Trust and Anti Monopoly charges and fine each party the equivalent of the National Debt. That would bankrupt both parties!
Well if you feel good about voting that way you should. Just be honest with yourself that that is why you are doing it so you can feel good. It doesn’t send a message and no one cares but you and may be some like minded friends. Of course some will complain that you “threw your vote away” but they will forget about that soon enough and post a meme about Obama playing golf and why that means we need to stop Hillary. LOL
I respect your choice to vote and thank you for respecting mine not to. God willing we will both have something to truly vote for some day like removing or restricting government power. That is about all that does it for me any more!
As to suing the Dems and Reps that won’t work. They do nothing to prevent other parties, many exist, just being big doesn’t make you a monopoly not to mention two big companies are seen as proof no monopoly exists. Even if I was on a jury for this I would vote that they don’t have a monopoly nor do they violate anti trust laws. They don’t, there are plenty of other options people just refuse to take them.
When you first become a libertarian you believe everyone really is a libertarian. You start telling people about it, sadly you quickly learn, no, no they are not. Most Americans are neo fascist statists. I know that sounds horrible, there is a reason and it is because it is horrible! But when you start talking even to “small government conservatives” the amount of shit they want government to do, out law, regulate and interfere with is mind numbing.
The reason you had two neo fascist statists running for president in 2012 is because most Americans want slightly different versions of just that.
I do vote. For the most part I vote as follows depending on who is on the ballot. Libertarian. A different third party or independent. The candidate that is not the incumbant.
Just gonna throw some numbers out there using the last presidential election just because they where easy to find. http://uselectionatlas.org/RESULTS/national.php There was 60,338,167 registered voters that did not vote. There where 2,382,644 votes that went to candidates other then Obama or Romney. I would bet that most of the people that did not vote gave reasons like what was mentioned above. If instead of not voting they voted for a third party or independent I can’t help but feel that the two major parties would take notice. Hypothetically the vote count could have been Obama: 65,918,507 , Other: 62,720,811 , Romney 60,934,407.
I have to agree with Douglas that the Dems and Reps do have a monopoly. Just about every state has ballot access laws in place that make it harder if not imposable for third parties and independents to get on the ballot. The R and D ignore alot of these laws but still get on the ballot.
Um Chris there were not 60,000,0000 registered voters that didn’t vote. That is just not true.
Perhaps eligible voters but certainly not registered.
Sadly you think if they did vote by the way they’d vote third party, they likely wouldn’t. Most Americans are statists, they want government running their lives and saying every problem they have is someone else’s fault. The sad reality is this nation has been so conditioned to slavery that they are terrified of freedom.
The reason you get a leftist neo fascist statist on one side of the ballot and a right wing neo fascist statist on the other side is your nation is now made up of people that want neo fascist statists running their nation. You will say it isn’t true, then I give you this challenge, find 25 people random off the street and present them with cutting government size and spending by 20%, many perhaps even most in some places will say great. Then show them what has to be cut to make it happen, see how quickly they try to slit your throat and then tell me our nation isn’t now a nation of statists.
How do you ever expect that such a nation will vote for freedom? Voting is a waste of time right now, the work that is necessary is getting people to remove their chains and want to be free first.
My #1 shared episode is 1088. ‘Nuff said.
Those who do nothing more than vote will have little effect on any political system. Patriotism requires one to stay informed about and stay involved with the entire system. Learn the problems, determine solutions, promote your choices, influence your elected officials, and then vote.
Why vote? Everything that you said before that is more effective. I can add 10 more items to that list easily. So why in the end vote, just because you are supposed to.
Let’s put it another way, if you wanted to destroy me, destroy the Survival Podcast which below would be the best course of action…
A. Set up a competition with voting and say look he lost, he sucks
B. Attack me head on with a propaganda campaign
C. Walk away and ignore me
People think those in power quake when say a third party gets 10% of the vote. They don’t, they shit their pants though when participation drops.
Please think about this, people in power always try to prevent the people they control from doing anything that meaningfully disrupts their power and control. So why do you think it is so important to your government that you vote? Why would they program you from 8 years old with school elections voting for presidents that kids know nothing about, setting up student government when such governments have no power, conditioning you 100% to believe that voting is essential to your nation and it is your duty to do it?
If voting created any threat to those in power, they would not want us doing it. So you are left with one sad reality, our voting feeds their control mechanism.
I agree with your assessment of the political circus and the impotence of my vote. But I will continue to cast my vote simply out of respect for those countless American patriots through American history who have given their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor to give me that right.
But they didn’t! No war since the American Revolution was fought over the right to vote. I mean that all sounds like a good talking point but the men who gave their lives for you freedom, they were never thinking, I am doing this so my nation keeps the right to vote. This is programming pure and simple.
I mean again it is a nice thought, but if you want it to be based in fact, do it to honor the 25,000 that died in the Revolutionary war. 8,000 of these deaths were in battle; the other 17,000 recorded deaths were from disease, including about 8,000–12,000 who died of starvation or disease brought on by deplorable conditions while prisoners of war.
If you do so at least then your spirit is in the right place. May be you can make a case for the war of 1812. After that every war we fought was on foreign soil and was never even remotely about your right to vote.
I challenge you to think about this one liners that make you feel voting is a duty. Again if voting is a duty that means one of the people on that ballot is entitled to your vote even if they are not worthy of it. Also please remember this. Hitler, Mao, Saddam Husein, Mousilini, Idi Amin, Chiang Kai-shek, Ho Chi Minh, Pol Pot and Stalin all were elected. Eventually each suspended elections etc and that is the image they want you to have of them, dictators with complete power that just controlled their nations. However each was first likely in many ways the “lesser of two evils” in someones mind.
I think you are being presumptuous in claiming to know what’s gone on in the minds of those who have served and sacrificed for our country. Whatever the dark motivations of TPTB, I still believe in the sincerity of the majority of those who serve their country. They are not signing on to fight for a political machine, or corrupt candidates. They are fighting for an ideal; for the principles of freedom our country was founded on and is supposed to represent. And one of the foundational principles is that of having a voice in the process; being a democratic republic. So yes, I am choosing to participate in that process, to honor the ideal, not the individuals I am voting for. And yes, it is often a lesser of evils proposition. That is our reality. And to say because we fall so short of the ideal and the perfect candidate or party or platform isn’t out there we should just take our toys and go home is rather quixotic, I think. I would have had much lower blood pressure with Mitt Romney as president than Barack Obama, and those who stayed home rather than vote for a Mormon, or a vulture capitalist, or a Bildergerger, or whatever other aspect of his persona offended their sensibilities, are all equally to blame for this country’s unprecedented shame under this POS POTUS. And while Barack Obama is a quantum leap down the road to an American Moussolini, a Romney would have at least slowed the slide. As Voltaire intimates, let’s not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Or even the lesser of evils. We always have a choice. You choose to stay home; I choose to honor people and principles that mean something to me, regardless of the outcome. I guess I see it all about my voice. I will continue to speak even when noone is there to listen, just because it is still my right and I believe in it. One day I may no longer have that right. And then I will stay home, and my choices will be different ones.
Again I served in the US Army Airborne during time of war. Don’t tell me about the mind of those who served, I know the mind, it was at one time my own. Men who think they are going to war and get orders to do so talk.
Where we sincere? You bet! Did we believe in what we were asked to do? Yes.
Did any of us ever say even one time, “we are fighting for the right to vote”? Never.
Further as a solider I took an oath to defend the constitution against all enemies both foreign and DOMESTIC. So if you want to honor my sacrifice (which is very minor) and the oaths of all others who served, never endorse anyone who is a DOMESTIC threat to the constitution with your vote.
Again, I do know what soldiers facing war think. I don’t think you do. The biggest reason you stand up in the end, isn’t government, it isn’t the constitution, it isn’t mom and apple pie, nor is it the right to vote. They use that to sell you on dawning the uniform. When you are in harms way you worry about two things, staying alive and helping the guys next to you stay alive.
I do hope you continue to speak, I also hope you realize that if you speak in the right ways, you voice should and can and will be heard.
Oh and president Mitt, you may have felt better but you’d have the same RESULT. I could care less that Mitt is a Morman, I do consider him a traitor to the US Constitution so neither he nor Obama qualify for the honor of my endorsement. And if I had voted for him and everyone in my neighborhood did, he still would have won my state as he was always going to and he still would have lost the election like he was always going to.
Mitt did his job, he was never going to win, it wasn’t part of the plan, he knew it, I knew it and sadly most Americans didn’t.
The fate of America is literally at stake.
We have a President who opposes quarantining red hot ebola zones. Whoever is elected to Congress is all that stands between Obama and destruction.
Are the Republicans perfect? No. In fact the Republicans are the worst candidates, except for all the other Dem candidates.
Your forefathers fought and died so you could vote, so stop whining. Vote.
Wow since I already destroyed every point you made in the above article no need to do it again here.
Also why do you assume I would or others who are not voting would vote the way you think we will.
If everyone not happy with the Demorats, and Republicants would support, financially and vote for the Libertarian Party there would be a landslide shift.
Those people pissed at both parties are NOT libertarians. Most are pissed because their side hasn’t “done enough” the entire point of the Libertarian party is to stop doing, un do and cut. You really think most non voters want that? How many would be okay cutting military spending by 30% at which point we would still be outspending the next 10 highest spending nations combined? How many would be okay with getting rid of the Department of Education, which we really don’t need. How many would be okay phasing out social security?
If aliens gave us a free energy device that would be awesome but it ain’t going to happen. Please listen to the last part of today’s show when it comes out.
As it is now it just a wasted vote.
Sad that you people bitch when people don’t vote yet you bitch even more when people don’t vote the way you want them too.
And what do you care if you are bound and determined to step out of the system by NOT voting? I just what people to vote or kindly shut the fuck up. Vote whatever your heart desires but realize that we live in a TWO PARTY SYSTEM, like it or not. And any vote outside of those two parties is just a wasted vote. Maybe down the run when everything comes together and the US folds we can come up with a system that gives a third party an actual chance but until then…
Listen you are the one that came here and started attacking me, you are the one that emailed me and cussed me multiple times. You now say I guess because your writing has enough typos to be incoherent that people like me should “kindly shut the fuck up”, no see your contention is that I am a defeatist, but I am not, there are four boxes for the preservation of liberty, they are
Soap, Ballot, Jury and Ammo
The saying goes to please use them in that order. If I did so I would be damn close to Ammo! I was only called to serve on a jury once and as soon as they determined I was a free thinker I was sent away. So I may one day get called again but we shall see. So Jury doesn’t give me much of an option.
Therefore I will stick to the soap box for now. Telling people what the hell real liberty looks like. People like you are the defeatists, you are those who have surrendered, it is wrapped into your very language. You said,
“Maybe down the run when everything comes together and the US folds we can come up with a system that gives a third party an actual chance but until then…”
And your first right wing talk radio talking point was what?
“And as I see it this country is headed for a cliff without any stopping. So vote for the Republicans and have the car Sunday drive its way to the cliff’s edge or vote for the Democrats (and by extension any and all third parties) and we launch off the cliff at greater than highway speed. I, for one, would rather the country slowly reach its sad demise than get there at breakneck speed.”
Okay not only is that line very old it is totally incongruent with your statement I quoted first, that may be a third party will be elected after the US folds? I mean you are saying the only hope for liberty is the collapse of the empire, then let us stall the fall of the empire in the next breath? And let us stall this fall by putting traitors that are not quite as bad into office? To do so by honoring them with the privilege of our endorsement in the form of our vote when we know they are still driving our nation off a fiscal and moral cliff on a road strait to tyranny.
These are your words and your thoughts simply presented back to you. Do I now look like he who surrenders or do you?
Again I didn’t say I will never vote, I didn’t say you should not. I simply told you the truth, in 99% of all elections your vote doesn’t matter, it doesn’t do a damn thing. Further that in my district, county, state this year there is nothing for me to vote for. That instead of sanctioning traitors with my vote in an election where nothing I do will change anything I will simply abstain.
For this you curse at me, you attack my moral character and you use defeatist language while you call me a defeatist?
Do you not now realize how deep the programming must be? Can you really examine the exchange here an tell me you are the one fighting for liberty by voting and I am not because I accept logic and math and seek other avenues to open minds, spread liberty and influence our nation to do things that encourage real self reliance, self responsibility and targeted acts of civil disobedience to unconstitutional and immoral laws?
What I say here will unlikely be read, will mean little to those who DO read it, and will be like spitting in the ocean to the rest. However, it needs to be said. To not be engaged in the political process, to not vote, to fail to make calls, send emails, letters, and other correspondence with elected officials, is to give the whole process, and our country, over to the devil.
Sorry for you naysayers, but I’m unwilling to do that. It may not make THE difference, but I pray it will make A difference.
Yes, all politics is local – that’s where it must start, but it must carry forward to the county/borough level, the state, and the national level as well.
So you’re a good man/woman? Then following Burke, all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for you to do nothing. I, for one, am not willing for evil to triumph – I intend to do something. It may be small, and not be THE deciding vote – but I WILL vote.
Blessings,
Son of Liberty
Voting for one traitor over another still results in a tyrant running your nation.
+1
A man wishing change recognizes when the game is rigged and seeks another.
It’s exactly this kind of apathy and defeatism, that has brought our nation to the brink of destruction. Evil men prosper only when good men do nothing. Not voting does not send a message, and if you’re not voting, ask yourself ” Who is ?”. By not doing our duty as Americans, we are in fact casting a vote for the greater evil rather than the lesser. I would truly hate to have whiners and quitters like this on my combat team. surrender is not an option in this fight.
It is impossible that you read this article in full and responded as you did unless you simply didn’t understand what you read.
Further if you want to vote for the lesser evil, go for it. Why do people like you always assume that those of us that don’t vote would vote for your side if we did by the way?
I agree with the previous poster. I have nothing good to say about a surrender monkey like you. Go crawl in your hole, with your beans bullets and other butt kissers. I read your immature diatribe and the only words I could come up with were “what an asshole.”
And yes, I did read your 8th grade level rant, in its painful entirety. Please leave our country to those that will fight. We don’t need cowardly defeatist little fucks like you.
I see that comments are moderated. So I am sure you will delete mine, you defeatist pussy. Pansies like you need everyone to agree with them. Well I don’t, you suck and so do your shallow ideals. Man up and fight or get the fuck out of America. Leave it to actual men to clean up the mess made by the socialists.
Now don’t you look like an idiot! Yes comments are moderated until you have made a few it is how I protect my audience from spam. You are entitled to your opinion but you have offered no supporting logic, math, reality or fact in support there of. Now you are un-moderated, so go ahead and try, see if you can justify your beliefs.
Further if you call me a “surrender monkey” (what ever the fuck that might be) please show me where you have done more to impact this nation for greater individual liberty, personal freedom and individual responsibility than I have. I am waiting, go ahead, let us “throw down” good sir, I stand ready. You tell me what you have done to make this nation a better place including checking boxes, I shall tell you what I have done and in the end let us both logically agree whom has done more. I stand waiting.
Note that at this juncture you have called me a pussy and a surrender monkey and a pansy and told me who has pledged to fight and die for your rights to “get the fuck out of America” and I have referred to you only as “good sir”.
Its funny how you admit the government is destroying the private healthcare industry but also blame the health insurance companies. Did you know for example they are taxed on their income before even taxing their profits? Obamacare imposes a new sales tax on health insurance that increases the cost of health care coverage. The amount of the tax will be $8 billion in 2014, increasing to $14.3 billion in 2018, and increased based on premium trend thereafter. The Joint Committee on Taxation estimates that the health insurance tax will exceed $100 billion over the next ten years. In other words if United Health Care were to take in $1 billion and have $1 billion in expenses they would still owe the government on their “profit”. It’s crazy and all that is BEFORE taxing them again on what’s left. The insurance companies take huge risks covering members and in many cases aren’t properly reimbursed by the government in the case of Medicare and they are to blame? This is one topic where I agree with your predicted outcome (the government wants to take over our Healthcare entirely, not sure it will be by 2020 though) but you don’t have the facts on half the equation.
Oh of course I blame both government and insurance companies. I blame the pharmaceutical companies even more. Obamacare was DESIGNED to ruin what was left of the health insurance industry but the insurance industry itself was abusive for so long they set the stage for their own elimination. I stated on air MONTHS before Obamacare passed before the bill was even on the floor it would happen and that the destruction of the private health insurance industry was the goal. That you were not going to stop it and never were. If we had elected McCain you’d have McCain care now. Fricken Romneycare in Mass was the BLUEPRINT FOR OBAMACARE.
How do so many people fail to see this. You were getting health care “reform” designed to ruin what was left of the industry no matter who was president.
By not voting you are in turn taking away votes from the side that best represents your beliefs. Let’s be honest, both major parties suck (third parties are simply a wasted vote). And as I see it this country is headed for a cliff without any stopping. So vote for the Republicans and have the car Sunday drive its way to the cliff’s edge or vote for the Democrats (and by extension any and all third parties) and we launch off the cliff at greater than highway speed. I, for one, would rather the country slowly reach its sad demise than get there at breakneck speed.
Your right wing jedi mind trick doesn’t work here, back to Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity with you now. Neither side represents my beliefs. Worse though neither side represents your well being.
So, you are…
1. Voting for someone/something you don’t really really believe in.
2. Voting out of fear.
We can do better.
In Tennessee this election cycle there are 4 amendments on the ballot. For any of them to take effect, not only do the yesses have to outweigh the no’s – the yesses have to be at least 50% + 1 vote MORE than what the Governor receives in votes… So, even if the polls say that Amendment 2 is a shoe-in to make sure the state Supreme Court MUST be voted on and NOT appointed… it would still go down in flames if enough people didn’t come out and vote. So, this is a perfect case to vote FOR an amendment that restricts government (or another that allows grocery stores to sell wine… yeah, we still don’t have that one) and at the same time NOT VOTE for the Governor’s race and you get a twofer… you add to the result of getting more liberty and at the same time you can give the finger to the big race by making it one more less vote to have to get to get the amendment passed.
And, I do think your county elected offices have more impact on your wallet and more impact on your freedoms than State and National… wake up one day and you find that your county commissioners restricted what you can do with your land (like in my county if you have less than 5 acres you can only have ONE outbuilding and it has to be no more than 75% the size of your dwelling. There is a constant grind to grow codes, zoning and other regulations that continue to encroach on your freedoms – why not make a dif at the local level… and it not just your vote… I have seen many local races that 20 to 50 votes would have made the difference… you and yours make two and all the folks you know could be a lot more…. I organize to protect my local property rights from the codes bastards that want to artificially control the market and where growth will happen by passing a zoning change that restricts the unincorporated area from developing the standard 3 units per acre (which is what is has always been) to only 1 unit per acre EXCEPT where the bastards think it would be cool to have High Density, mixed-use more “livable, walkable, less-auto dependent” communities. So, I got a group of like minded freedom type (actually tea party types) and we organized and then we held a big public town-hall style meeting where I gave about an hour powerpoint presentation about the evils of the new “comprehensive plan” our county wanted to rubber stamp and had been working on for two years. We gathered emails and kept people informed and we filled up the county commission public comment meetings and we wore their asses out… we prevailed in the 11th hour (as we got organized just before the final vote) and the postponed the vote and we kept pressing at each meeting and the county planner finally acquiesced and kept the original 3 units/acre which gutted their plan and their intentions. Of course the gov’t will never stop going in that direction but hell, for a moment we felt like we just gave King George the two fingers and sent the enemy packing… So, I do have faith on the local level when the bastards try to oppress…
As I commented above, I’m in Tennessee and will only be voting for the amendments. But I’d like to challenge your point on Amendment 2. My litmus test is, does it increase individual liberty? I say this does not. If you look at the entire reason this amendment was brought forward, it was because the so called Tennessee Plan, a merit based selection process culminating in a judicial appointment by the governor, and THEN a subsequent retention election does not comply with “judges shall be elected by qualified voters” which is the state constitutional language as it stands. While this amendment may be a step toward liberty in practice, it does so by erasing liberty already in the constitution which they were ignoring.
In other words, the state constitution already says judges must be voted on… by qualified voters. They’re just been ignoring it since 1971. Why should I hand that to the legislature in Nashville?
I’m backtracking. My understanding was that the Tennessee Plan had been stuck down and I see it was not. I’m giving further consideration to my vote on Amendment 2. Thank you.
@ModernSurvival I’m mostly in agreement with you Jack. The only reason I’m even bothering is these state constitutional amendments which I believe to be 1. in play and 2. would change the outcome of the future of the state.
That to say, I’m learning and enjoying engaging in this intelligent debate, something that is sorely lacking in this country.
And yes, I’m aware that US Senators were once appointed by the state legislature, but admittedly haven’t done any before and after analysis of the result of the change.
The immediate question that popped to mind was that lobbyists like concentrated power as well, as they don’t have to make their case to 50.1% 7 million people, but, (in Tennessee’s case) 50.1% of 135 people. And this is the conundrum I find myself in.
Keep in mind I was talking to Jake and Jake is a friend and I like to jack with him. I can actually see the ability to get rid of a justice as valid. Make sense better then lifetime appointments.
However, the fact that this is even necessary tells you how screwed we are.
JUDGES ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE POLITICAL!
If the court system was worth a damn, most 7 judge decisions would be 7-0 or 0-7. Judges are to judge the law, not their political leanings. This is why they were never to be elected.
Frankly I’d prefer to see judges judged by a computer algorithm for consistency with the law today rather than voted on by voters who generally only know the name of 2-3 candidates on a ballot with 30-40 names on it!
@ModernSurvival My bad. I look now and it’s clear you were talking to Jake, but when I saw it originally, I thought it was directed at me.
Regarding judges, we just had a supreme court rule that an appointment of a judge by the governor and subsequent retention election 8 years later was consistent with our state constitution’s language : The judges of the Supreme Court shall be elected by the qualified voters of the state.
Regardless of how you feel about voting, that’s clearly an erroneous ruling. The only reason I think they did it was that they would’ve invalidated their own appointments and that of every state supreme court justice and appellate judge since 1971 and placed all their rulings in question.
That’s what’s bringing about Amendment 2 that Jake brought up.
Also, sometimes it’s hard for me to put the reply in the right spot to the right person. Sometimes the reply link appears and sometimes it doesn’t.
So you are voting for more voting. You know that was done before right with Federal Senators and it didn’t work out so well. The citizen had a LOT more power over a senator when they were appointed by the state House and Senate, a LOT more power. People were sold 17th amendment with “your senator should be accountable to you” and by spreading that vote as a popular vote across an entire state the urban areas immediately got greater power, the senate at once began to become more liberal. Yay voting!
maybe so… but would you rather vote for the Supreme Court justice or let your rino/progressive/part of the system Governor choose his lackey? Again, this is a local/state issue and people can still have an influence…
You do realize that the same people that elect the RINO will be electing the judge right?
btw, I’m glad you self-medicated with some of my raw-ferrel bee honey… thanks for the shout-out.
I just made some Apple Pie Moonshine and honey was part of it, yours again, too bad you won’t be here next week.
Touche’ on who elects rinos… got me there…
That’s a bitch ain’t it!
Here’s a question for you Jack, let’s say the state legislature in Texas has a significant change in complexion… and then Texas implements Connecticut style gun laws and then implement Maryland style anti-septic system legislature (pretty much banning the ability to build/live in rural areas unless you are already there. What would you do?
The truth is likely leave Texas. But your inference is that my vote would be able to prevent this in the first place. I am simply acknowledging the fact that it can not and won’t. Again if there was anything on my ballot not pre determined that I cared about I would vote, do you people not read, do you not see all the words even in a title?
Why I Won’t Bother To Vote this Year
THIS YEAR
How hard is that to comprehend?
Will I vote in 2016? For president, NO, I already know how that will work out.
In any local or state level measures?
We shall see. If legalizing marijuana is on the ballot yes. If an amendment strengthening our constitution by prohibitions on government is on the ballot, yes.
By the way the Texas State Constitution makes laws like they have in CT about guns impossible at this time. There’d have to be a state constitutional amendment for that.
Frankly the facts are simple, only the 2nd keeps me in this nation paying these criminals a tax bill that makes me sick, take that away and I am done, I will go to Costa Rica where by the way they may say I only may own so many guns personally, but my company can own plenty on my behalf and an AR with a 30 round mag is just fine. Then I can grow citrus and tell these pricks destroying my nation to piss off for good!
Some will say that is unAmerican, I say when America chooses to cease being America, that claim no longer applies.
Right now just by moving to Costa Rica I could save about 50K a year, there is more than one way to walk to freedom you know.
That is kinda my point. At the risk of conjuring up a rant from you, check this out: http://www.redstate.com/diary/laborunionreport/2011/12/28/the-colorado-model-the-lefts-stratagem-for-turning-red-states-to-blue/
This is how those 4 rich liberals were able to turn Colorado (Called “The Colorado Model”) to a blue legislature in only 2 election cycles – which is also how they were able to follow up and pass stupid gun laws… Texas is now a target… I hope you guys can repel this. However, if folks are spectators I guess I’ll have to come to your workshops in Costa Rica… So, even if you think both are evil, you must have as least had some affinity to the local legislatures of your state and the culture it creates or at least the legacy of what good sirs stood for in Texas. Would a wholesale change of the current “red state legislators” turn to “blue” make a difference in your day-to-day lifestyle? Would pulling the lever to keep the “red guys” in there make a difference? I don’t know… but I wouldn’t want to give them an inch.
The insanity is filtrating down to the local level. The thing that struck me about the Colorado Model (I read the book) was the State gov who was Republican and pro-gun was just outgunned by these 4 rich libs who created their own “echo chamber” and used outright lies to keep this gov on his heels… the guy didn’t have a clue what was happening to him and consequently the model was able to convince enough folks that it was time for hope and change.
I don’t want to believe Texas could fall like this but Hell, Houston’s mayor is now requiring every church (pastor, priest etc) to turn over their transcripts of their sermons to see if they were participating in “hate speech” – although I just saw the headlines saying the mayor had now dropped the subpoena – but not before local people got political on a local level…
@Jake I see you haven’t spent much time in CO. CO. went left because it is full of big government liberals.
Costa Rica??? It ranked 53rd on the freedom scale out of 175 countries in the world. If you’re going to vote with your feet, please do a little more research. Twenty years after ones military experience is not based in current reality.
Who wrote the scale and do I care! I can answer the second part, no. I do not base my opinion of Costa Rica on my military experience. I base in on TAX LAW and ease of acquiring citizenship, after which I can travel the world freely without Uncle Sams Yoke.
Okay I looked up your index I consider it fucking worthless. Top on it Hong Kong, second was Singapore. What ever metrics they base “freedom” on there they are not the ones I value.
How about adding other countries to your Walk To Freedom site? The US is not even in the top 10 countries on the new freedom survey. At least list tne top 10 countries!
That’d be good; if any other country had the 2nd Amendment I bet there would be a TON of expatriates!!!
That’s true, you have what’s left of the 2nd, but it seems that is about the only point left from the original Constitution, don’t you think? So, if you’re defending the 2nd with your guns and not the original Constitution, it say you are only defending your own a$$ with your guns. You should have moved out already!
I really don’t think you made a coherent point. First he did not say he was ONLY defending his own ass with his guns but I damn sure will defend myself with my guns and really could not give a fuck if you or anyone else doesn’t like it. I think most people feel the same way.
Again you just made no point and I think anyone who read your comment wasted about 20 seconds of their life they shall never get back.
This discussion made me think about “Walking to Freedom” – why would we encourage people to do this? What if many left somewhere like a New York and go to somewhere like Texas? If they do not vote at the state and county/city level then they are really just “running from Tyranny” and hope the next place doesn’t go down hill while the invest years to get their food forrest et al established and enjoy it before they have to bug out to Costa Rica.
Unless all these freedom walkers ban together (like the New Hampshire project) then just leaving is only part of the equation. Seems like I remember you selling the idea that when more like minded people frequent the same state that things would happen… maybe the state they left will make changes… but if both parties are basically scum, why even hope for this type of change?
Again, I see your point on a national level, but if we are actually trying to get folks to vote with their feet, it could be a heck of a note when they arrive to find you are expatriotic ;>)
The people that banned together in NH are a perfect example.
You don’t get it because you have never been to Liberty Forum, go there and you will find people that don’t never did and will never vote. Many of them having done more for liberty in NH than any politician or voter.
You will also find people that are now State Reps and State Senators also part of FSP. You will find them working together, getting shit done and you WILL NEVER see the politically active call the anarcho people working outside of the system for the same goal unpatriotic or apathetic.
Why vote with your feet, well because it fucking works that’s why.
The problem with MOST voters is they think voting does something when most of the time it doesn’t. That is fine if they are otherwise active in or out of the system. But more and more that once every two year box check becomes “what I can do” and leads to not really doing shit. Perhaps even writing some well crafted letters that get answered by a your reps and having some young up and coming intern or page answer it with Form Letter C1. But nothing is accomplished.
The other problem with MOST voters is since they have equated voting with doing something when it isn’t they tend to no longer recognize how much more many non votes are doing and getting done.
You know all those FSP activists with protests, petitions, putting cameras in politicians faces, calling out corruption and making it visible to all, did you think most of them vote? Almost none of the people on that side of the coin vote, they are almost all anarchists.
None of you voters would have any of the ammo you do if it were not for the anarcho activists that generally do not vote.
Now your brain hurts, good, that means you are learning.
I hope you were giving me the bene of the doubt when you said “you voters” cuz I am one of those that record the local planning director and then make an expose’ video to change local planning laws.. .I am an “effectivist” and I do “do things” other than vote and hold signs.. Yes, I used to go to tea party events and hold signs… that lasted about the first year (’09) and figured out pretty fast it doesn’t do anything.. then I started banning together with other folks and we started doing stuff.. like review text books at local schools and call out the school board about erroneous or biased content. We would meet monthly for a year or so and taught/learned skills (raised bed gardening, canning, BOBs, mutual assistance groups, cooking outdoors, edible weeds, etc) and we also look at local issues as they pop up and organize to effect the outcome… but to say that not voting (again I am talking about local/state level) will not make a difference is giving the enemy at the gate a key to the city… is it not?
IF you and the others (like in NH) would vet the local candidates based on basic fundamentals like 2nd amendment, taxes, business etc why wouldn’t you insure you keep Texas “Texas” and not Taxus or something worse?
Sometimes people make shit hard, “The problem with MOST voters is”. Why do you think MOST says MOST and not you or most?
uh…. you said: “None of you voters would have any of the ammo you do if it were not for the anarcho activists that generally do not vote.” – not ‘most’ of your voters – ;>) Dund, Dund, dunnnnnnD
Well I stand by that to a large degree.
Interesting stuff Jake. Kinda stuff I’d like to be involved in. Are you on the forum by chance? If so, look me up. bryanyoung is my handle
Hey Bryan, I’m not on the forum… but you can contact me directly Jake at Earnware dot net. or six/one/five-four/two/four-five/eight/one/seven cheers,
I heard about one election in Europe where people wrote in “Rhinoceros,” and the rhinoceros won the election. Not sure what they did after that.
The story goes that the number one write in for US President is Mickey Mouse. It would be interesting to get a count on it, the fact that there isn’t a count says something about how much a vote counts at the presidential level by the way.
@ModernSurvival I actually voted for this guy in 2010. He ran again the Republican primary, but I missed it this year.
His videos are gold.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hvaeHllwtw
If you google around, you can find a debate he did with the Green Party candidate.
I’d vote for this guy, LOL, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz_V4lRdtjo
People who don’t vote piss me off, especially people who don’t vote and make a point of telling the rest us why we shouldn’t either.
Please tell me WHERE in this article I told anyone else not to vote. And while I thank you for your service both of us know when you were serving “fighting for the right to vote” wasn’t on your mind.
Further why does it piss you off that I don’t vote, if I did I would
1. Most likely vote against what you want, that would also piss you off because voting is never good enough for people that make a big deal about this.
2. I would likely in most instances vote for a third party and so you would then tell me I am wasting my vote.
As a vet you took an oath to the constitution to defend it against ALL ENEMIES BOTH FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC.
I took that same oath so I will not endorse with my vote any person I see to be a threat to the constitution.
By the way, yes I did do my time in a combat zone to help preserve our right to live in freedom. I am a proud Vietnam veteran and a proud infidel.
This is from Richard Maybury’s newsletter back before the bush elections (2000). Harry Browne is dead now and this election is far gone, but the POINT he is making is a true one — do NOT waste your vote. And unless you do this — vote for the libertarian who cannot win — and don’t play the game. You are wasting your vote.
——
Don’t Waste Your Vote
Imagine a presidential election in which you can choose among three candidates. Candidate A plans to reduce the federal government to the limits demanded by the Constitution. This will cut the government’s size, and your taxes, by at least 75%.
However, few voters have heard of this candidate, he has little chance of winning.
Candidate B plans to expand the government’s size and power, and your taxes, by 20%. He is the most widely known of the candidates.
Candidate C will bring an increase of 10%, and is also well known.
Which do you choose?
The power junkies in Washington don’t really care whether you go for B or C, as long as you do pick one of these. They expect you to go for C.
In the typical voter’s mind, if he chooses C, meaning the 10% increase, he is being realistic. The candidate who offers what the voter really wants cannot win, so the voter chooses the lesser of the two evils.
This means he chooses evil.
This is all the power junkies want. As long as you vote to make the government larger, they are happy.
The monster won’t grow as fast as they’d like, but it will grow.
They want you to throw your vote away, to vote for what you don’t believe in.
My guess is that most readers of this article will indeed vote for C, meaning George Bush.
But maybe you are different. Maybe you are realistic enough to admit that your vote won’t accomplish anything, it’s just a drop in the bucket, so you might as well use it to send a message to Washington that you want less government.
In that case, you will vote for candidate A — Harry Browne.
Please read Browne’s book, THE GREAT LIBERTARIAN OFFER. Even if you don’t plan to vote for Browne and the Constitution — even if you will eventually despair and cast your ballot for Tweedledum or Tweedledummer — you will find THE GREAT LIBERTARIAN OFFER to be most interesting and enlightening. You will understand what others don’t about issues now in the news. Call toll free 1-888-377-0417; http://www.HBBooks.com.
You will also enjoy Browne’s 29-minute videotape.After he explains why the cost of government programs is nearly always greater than the benefits, you are treated to a man-on-the-street interview asking, what is your favorite government program? One passer-by answers, “That’s like asking, what is my favorite disease?”
This I promise. The only vote that has a prayer of being noticed is one for a candidate who cannot win. This is a vote that is different, it is a slap in the face to the Washington establishment. No one in Washington will admit it, but they watch this kind of vote much more carefully than any other. They know that when you vote this way, you are defiantly shouting at them, “you don’t own me!
But while the spirit here right, the facts it concludes with are wrong. No one that voted or Browne send a message to anyone. No one really cared.
I have been happily wasting my vote since 2004. As mentioned in an earlier post I normally vote for the Libertarian candidate if one is running. If one is not running I will likely vote for an independent candidate. Third option is any third party candidate. Last option if there is only an R or a D I vote for the one that is not the incumbent.
I know my vote is not likely to change anything but not voting will definitely never change anything.
It only takes me about 20 minutes (normally 5 to 10 minutes) at most to cast my vote. I have wasted more time in a checkout line at Wal Mart.
I will always vote as long as I am able! Why? Because we have a right to vote when most of the planet does not! I consider it an obligation as an American Citizen. I will write in names when there is no acceptable candidate. I will vote for the most conservative candidate I can find on the ballot and if none, write one in. The problem with the country today is not the parties, but the citizens/voters! Yes, the people. We make the government what it is, and if we sit back and vote for bad candidates in the primaries, then we have no one to vote for in the elections. As a society, we have gotten lazy, self centered and don’t have time to get out and help a good candidate get elected. It really upsets me when people take the easy way out and not only stay home, but refuse to work to make the government better. The lazy attitude is what gave us what we have, and will only contribute to it getting worse. My hope is that Paul was trying to rile some folks up, but if not he makes his own decisions just like each of us do, and most make bad decisions today…
Okay again if you want to vote, go ahead and I think you should but let us examine some of your reasons.
“We have a right to vote when most of the planet does not”
Is this true, no it isn’t. Most of the planet? Seriously there are elections in Russia and no there isn’t one candidate on the ballot. India has elections there are more than a billion people in India. Canada, Mexico, all of the Americas have voting rights. The only nation in the entire Hemisphere that doesn’t is Cuba and that is likely our fault at this point. So this claim just isn’t true.
“It is an obligation as an American Citizen.”
How do you defend this? If I am obligated to vote, someone is entitled to my vote that is the only logical conclusion.
I agree with you that the problem is the voters themselves to a degree. But the bigger problem is the system. Do you know what the party dues system is? Do you know how it works? If you want a meaningful discussion about voting at the Federal level without that, well, it isn’t possible. Please visit this site, http://definingthemachine.com/ and learn about it. Change can not occur in this current system.
And to this sentiment, ” Because we have a right to vote when most of the planet does not!”
Let me add this, you seem to believe the bullshit that our nation is “free” we are not. We are not even the freest in the world, we are not even close. According to the Heritage Foundation (by the way the Heritage Foundation is loved by right wing conservatives like Limbaugh and Hannity, I’m just sayin) we are not even in the top ten in the world. http://www.heritage.org/index/
We rank 12 behind nations like Estonia, Ireland and Chile
And how did we get there, we voted for it.
You say you vote for the most conservative candidate you can. Well great this is what you vote for then…
Blowing up innocent people in parts of the world that mean us no harm, (voting for the democrats is the same on this)
Increased spying on the American people, Bush passed the patriot act remember that? (voting for the democrats is the same on this)
Putting people in prison to be raped because the smoked or possessed a plant (voting for the democrats is MOSTLY the same on this)
Treating one group of people differently under the law that is supposed to apply equally to all due to their sexual preference (voting for the democrats is MOSTLY the same on this)
Spending more money than we have and bankrupting the nation (voting for the democrats is the same on this)
Keep it up, that will get us to liberty. Sigh!
What good candidate do you want me to help get elected by the way?
Do it for the sticker!
Anyone read Alexis de Tocqville?
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.”
“I do not know if the people of the United States would vote for superior men if they ran for office, but there can be no doubt that such men do not run.”
He thought Congressmen were crooks and Senators were better because they were not elected directly at that point.
Sigh.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2014/nov/11/facebook-posts/congress-has-11-approval-ratings-96-incumbent-re-e/