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Steven Richards
11 years ago

For the average couch-potato, you might be right. For someone that lifts weights, high GI is better for the gainz (and staying lean). The book Carb Backloading explains why.

Norcal Mike
Norcal Mike
11 years ago

I think that you will find as you get older that high GI (and low fat) will catch up with you and kill your drive to lift as much as needed to stay ripped. Calories matter, but every meal is a hormonal event. If you refrain from eating animal fat then you require your liver to work overtime to make all of your cholesterol, some of which is converted to sex hormones (which are very helpful to staying fit). The light that burns twice as bright burns only half as long.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

I’ve checked the torrent sites for a copy, but haven’t found anything yet. Just citing some scientific literature isn’t exactly proof that your interpretation of the literature is correct, or even that the scientist’s interpretation of the data is correct.

Donulld
Donulld
11 years ago

Well Amazon has a digital edition for sale, instead of looking for a pirated copy.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

I’m just speaking from what I’ve experienced. I’ve tried sweet potatoes and I’ve tried regular ole Russet baked potatoes; there’s no comparison.

shane
shane
11 years ago

are you on the Forum or Zello? Good to see another CBL guy on the survival podcast.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

Care to explain why you think high-GI is bad? It appears your beef is simply that the GI and GL of white potatoes is high. Why is high GI and GL bad?

A short lasting insulin spike after lifting weights, while insulin sensitivity of the muscles that were used is increased, but that goes away quickly, allows re-entry into ketogenesis (fat burning) asap. High-GI provides a short lasting spike, but low-GI provides a less intense, longer lasting insulin response.

Richard J
Richard J
11 years ago

Higher GI generally means faster insulin spikes; and quicker crash. The lower GI with similar level of overall carb would cause a more even availability of fuel. You dont ‘feel’ a difference between eating a white potato over a sweet because its not really relevant to your workouts as far as feel is concerned. Your assuming low level insulin response difference will make some drastic change in how you perform.

Assume you dont know shit BEFORE you speak, think, then type, then maybe you wont sound like it.

Just my dumbass opinion. 😉

Steven Richards
11 years ago
Reply to  Richard J

LOL @ advice to “assume you dont know shit” coming from someone that assumes I eat high-GI carbs for performance, even after I already spelled it out that I eat high-GI carbs for the gainz and staying lean

Richard J
Richard J
11 years ago

‘Performance’ was used as a general term, not a specific performance metric. But I digress.

Super cool elite types tend to get that confused. I understand.

Richard J
Richard J
11 years ago

You posted again while I was typing. Responding all in one post before hitting post button helps too.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

from the byebyecarbs website:

“You argue against the use of the Glycemic Index and cautioned people not to use it. The Glycemic Index has been around for more than 30 years and has been studied extensively. Why are you so against it?

The Glycemic Index was developed primarily for the use of diabetics to help control blood sugar levels. The test itself is to feed 50 g of a carbohydrate containing food to see what the blood sugar response is. It was never intended to be used in the development of menus. Researchers from Stanford University have now shown that the Glycemic Index has no physiological significance and although seeing different blood sugar level responses is interesting, that has no physiological meaning. In fact, the American Diabetes Association has never accepted the Glycemic Index as an effective way to help diabetics control their blood sugar levels.”

So why do you seem to think this guy recommends lower-GI?

I carb up AFTER lifting, and will continue doing so because it works, but thanks for being so concerned about my health 😉

Richard J
Richard J
11 years ago

Ive got my purple sweets growing strong. Korean purple sweet potato I was told.
Im trying to get a few more established this late just to see what happens with the rest of the summer and wether or not its truly too late to grow more from cuttings.

Hraz
Hraz
11 years ago
Reply to  Richard J

I’ve heard once (can’t remember where) that the purple sweets have an even lower GI than the orange sweets. Does anyone know if that is true. I’m growing some that should be ready in another month, can’t wait to try them. I want to try to grow more next year. What is the best method? Take cuttings and grow indoors until next May/June?

Hraz
Hraz
11 years ago
Reply to  Hraz

I found this on paleohacks about the nutritional differences in sweet potatoes:

http://paleohacks.com/questions/92959/nutrition-differences-in-different-varieties-of-sweet-potatoes#axzz2bJ8ZHqro

Okinawan sweet potato (white skin/purple flesh): One medium contains 30 g, of vitamin C, 19 mcg folate and traces of other B vitamins. Minerals include 271 mg potassium, 29 mg calcium, 37 mg phosphorus, 17 mg sodium, 13 mg magnesium, and traces of iron, zinc, copper, manganese and selenium. The purple pigment contains high levels of anthocyanin, an antioxidant.

Sweet Potato: Again medium-sized, they provide about 500 percent of your recommended vitamin A; 60 percent of your vitamin D; 45 percent of your vitamin C; 15 percent of your vitamin B-6; 10 percent of your riboflavin; 6 percent of your thiamine, folate, phosphorus and magnesium; 4 percent of your iron, niacin and calcium; and 2 percent of your zinc. Awesome source of potassium.

Yams: High in vitamin C, containing 8.2mg, or 14 percent of the recommended daily intake. Other vitamins include vitamin A, vitamin E, vitamin K, vitamin B6, choline, niacin, thiamin, folate and pantothenic acid. Minerals: potassium and manganese, each with 13 percent of the daily recommended value, calcium, magnesium, phosphorus, selenium, zinc, copper and iron.

And my absolute favourite in the world, the Japanese Sweet Potato: One medium Japanese sweet potato contains 4 percent DV for calcium and iron and contains significant amounts of magnesium, phosphorus, potassium, zinc, copper, manganese and selenium. Sweet potatoes contain B vitamins — thiamine, riboflavin, niacin, pantothenic acid, folate and B-6, as well as essential amino acids.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

You want to send me a copy of the book, I believe you have the email address to send it to. I’d be glad to read it. Otherwise, it seems kinda like a scam for you to suggest I buy a book you cited so I can prove to you how much I want to learn this BS. Doubt you’re rushing out to buy the book I mentioned… LOL

Lukasz
Lukasz
11 years ago

Jack,

You’ve made mistake in the article typing the same twice with different percentages:


The glycemic index of white potato is 47% higher then sweet potato
The glycemic index of white potato is 44% higher then sweet potato

Brent Eamer
Brent Eamer
11 years ago

“Tongue in cheek moment”

I only take diet advice from people who are older than I.

Jane Reed
Jane Reed
11 years ago

Missing in this discussion is the fact that, for persons who have abused their bodies for years, the affects of insulin resistance are more severe than for persons, perhaps including Steven Richards, who have eaten more moderately and exercised more smartly. I am more greatly affected by high carb and high glycemic foods than others might be. This does not contradict the science, Steven Richards. The well-known resilience of the human body has made it possible for you to eat high glycemic foods to no apparent ill effect. And if the research has shown that plaques are deposited when blood glucose is high, you have not escaped it, despite feeling good.

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago

Hey guys, I’m not a huge sweet potato fan but I’ve been thinking of replacing some of my white potato eating with sweet for various TSP-related reasons. Here’s the question, does preparing them in a certain way make them worse or better? Specifically, my favorite way to eat sweet potatoes is fried up in a little olive oil. I know O Oil isn’t the best thing for me, though I know it isn’t THAT bad in the grand scheme of things. But does frying potatoes in O Oil make them worse, better, or no different?

Jake
Jake
11 years ago

to avoid the issue of heating Olive Oil you might consider Coconut Oil.. it is solid at room temp (has a white color) it is a great cooking/frying oil and is very beneficial. I enjoy a tablespoon right out of the jar several times a week. If you get it cold pressed instead of heated it is supposed to be better but it may have a very faint hint of coconut. I have found those not cold processed to have a very mild delicious taste. All popcorn used to be popped with it at movie theatres but the food police decided a couple of decades ago that it wasn’t “healthy” – it’s fat, you know… Rush Limbaugh ranted on this for a while cuz he loves coconut cooked popcorn…

I love it.

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

Thanks Jack, good advice. Don’t worry about the marshmallow thing though, I can’t stand super sweet foods like that (except for desserts of course).

Norcal Mike
Norcal Mike
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

Coconut oil is great, very healthy. Jack did not mention these in the “do not eat” list but it is best to also avoid canola oil (rapeseed oil) and cottonseed oil. Besides being GMO these days, they are also very high in Omega 6-type fat, which increases systemic inflammation.

Roscoe
Roscoe
11 years ago

Jack,
Where would you consider the GI breakpoints to be between eat-your-ass-off, eat-in-moderation, and don’t-eat categories? Anything below 50 is eat-your-ass off? Is it lower than that? Anything higher than 85 is don’t eat? The link to the glycemic indexes for different foods is great but I’d appreciate your opinion.
Roscoe

Hraz
Hraz
11 years ago

Besides weight lifters thinking they can eat unlimited carbs, I think a lot of endurance athletes make the same mistake by consuming a ton of pasta before a race and then using those sugary sports gels during the race. There are a couple of athletes trying endurance events and training using a ketogenic diet.

Jake
Jake
11 years ago
Reply to  Hraz

I do know one thing… I had a friend that went fanatical on weight lifting and also put on tons of weight and bulked up big time… he looked like a mag cover lifter… but eventually he lost interest and all that muscle eventually turned to fat… or at least he looked like “fat bastard.” I wonder how many aging weight lifters wind up in that state of affair?

Alan
Alan
11 years ago

Thank you, Jack, for helping to clarify an issue that for many people is very confusing.

Tim
Tim
11 years ago

Are blue potatoes and yellow (Yukon) any better? I like growing them because they store well and produce a lot of food. Also mentioned was eating with fat makes you want more, but doesn’t it also slow the digestion of the sugars?
Thanks, I’m a pretty new listener, but love the show!

Tim
Tim
11 years ago
Reply to  Tim

I’m a 30yr old diagnosed with Crohn’s when I was 17. I’ve been med free for about 8yrs following a diet based on much of the Weston Price research (The Maker’s Diet). I probably should cut back on potatoes some.

Btw I finished my first on contour Hugel bed two weeks ago (5’x20 by hand), and hoping Jeff L offers his online PDC again, I just started listening when he was promoting it the first time.

ernest hale
ernest hale
11 years ago

if you add fat or combine foods it changes gi index

Steven Richards
11 years ago

Thanks for sending me the book, but I can’t find where the author makes the claim that low glycemic index is better; in fact, he keeps claiming that the glycemic index is useless… 🙂

Chickchoc
Chickchoc
11 years ago

I found this source of sweet potato varieties online. They have Japanese sweet pototatoes as well as many other varieties. Anybody have experience with them? They seem to have quite a bit of information on planting, too.

http://www.tatorman.com/

Steven Richards
11 years ago

Cool. Thanks again. Until then, I’m looking forward to my 2oz serving of russet potato post workout (and 4oz of chicken breast), before I switch back to high-fat, ultra-low-carb… 🙂

Jamie
Jamie
11 years ago

I took my A1c from 7.6 to 5.9 in the last 3 months only by changing my eating to Paleo (including sweet potatoes). If you don’t know, your A1c is a long term look at your blood sugar and insulin-resistance. Above 6.5 is considered diabetic.

This stuff works.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

The dose makes the poison. Anything is bad for us in large enough quantities. 🙂

Tony
Tony
11 years ago

Seems to me both of you guys are correct….except Steven is more civil in his discussion. Jack you need to calm down and watch your mouth, less you lose peoples respect.
IMHO

Tony
Tony
11 years ago

Wow….pretty sophomoric comment!
That “jackwagon” sucked the energy out of you because you let him.
And because Harris is a Dick … you should be too?

No advice just my opinion.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago
Reply to  Tony

Yeah – not sure why Jack devolves so quickly to the name-calling and the belittling. Sure, Steven is difficult that he has some points to dispute, but he is about 98% civil. Jack…not so much. 🙁

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago

I’ll defend Jack here. Steven was baiting Jack all along. It’s a very passive-aggressive way of being an A-Hole in that you get to make it look like you’re being the civil one (complete with cutsie little emoticons that are clearly insincere). Jack may have blown a gasket a little bit, but at least his reaction was honest.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

If what you say is true (that Steven was just trolling in a very passive / cutesy way), then Jack is in the right. I guess I just read it that Steven was disagreeing, but he undeserving of Jack putting him down.

But how I read it could have been wrong, and how you’re crafting it (with Steven as a bit of a troll) could be absolutely right.

I generally dont read the comments anymore because Jack seems to come down really hard on people that politely disagree with him. This article really captured my interest though and so it was natural for me to read the comments.

Once bitten, twice shy. I’ll just shut up now. Heh.

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago
Reply to  Rottenclam

yeah I’m just telling you how the whole exchange read to me. Jack is firey and passionate about the things he believes. I don’t always agree but I love his passion. It’s why I listen to the show every day.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago

@Jack – I have my opinions, and I share them freely. I consider myself a relatively civil and contemplative guy.

Never once have I “kissed Chris Duane’s ass” and I’ve never once called rob gray a psychopath (that whole schtick seems to be reserved for Chris and his crowd). I’ve enjoyed and learned from many things that Chris has said, but I have also been very critical (and unsupportive) of many other things that he has done, especially recently.

I know that you and rob gray have history. I remember the early shows where you would talk about getting “grass feed beef” from him. I supported AOCS a few years ago and bought a bunch of the first copper TSP rounds. Some of those videos that Chris posted with rob and his ionized water and the ‘mind mechanic’ stuff really gave me pause though. Perhaps I should not judge rob from such a colorful history…but I’ll admit that seeing that footage has left an impression on me.

My citing these examples and giving this background is by no means a way to build credibility as much as it is to give you a context of how much I have paid attention and advocated for you, DTOM, and AOCS in the last few years.

I very much appreciate your show and although I dont agree with all points all the time (something that you have encouraged!), I also recall that you want us to be civil to one another in these blog comments. The exception is when we’re talking about politicians. In that case, as you explained, “say whatever you want”.

The Paleo diet has never really interested me too much, but I did find your article intriguing. This other commenter, Steven Richards, with who you were sparring with was maybe trolling…and maybe he was not. It did not seem like you and he are good friends. I never did see Steven Richards call you names or belittle you in these comments. But maybe he was trolling here and I did not catch on to it.

Either way, I think you have mischaracterized me. I definitely have opinions that you would not like, but I’m not here to start trouble on behalf of Chris Duane or any of the DTOM crowd. I consider myself more of a TSP’er than a DTOM’er…but I will admit to finding value in the messaging from both you and Chris (and your respective sites / communities).

Peace.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago

Whoops – I meant “grass fed beef” in my prior comment.

If anybody has ‘grass feed beef’, they’re probably hanging out on a different kind of blog.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

@Jack – sure, there is a little bit of devolvement in that line, but I can definitely take some ribbing, as well as some flak for a somewhat provocative username. No problem there.

I’ve been through some internet drama before, and there is always more than what meets the eye (unseen emails). I believe that all parties have had serious faults in the whole DTOM / MM debacle.

But back on track to this article, I did enjoy it very much, and I do appreciate you taking the time to write it. Also, it may not seem like it, but I am always glad to see when you are talking to listeners / readers in the comments. Maybe the puritanical side of me just tends to bristle a bit when you start calling people names and things like that.

But hey – it is your blog, your podcast, and your site. If I dont like it, I am free to go elsewhere. There are way more things that you do which I like and admire than things that I’m put off by. I’ve followed your work for a number of years and continue to learn new things…so that is why I stick around. Enjoy your day.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago

Ok. Makes sense. But in that same breath, I have to admit you’ve piqued my curiosity on something. What do you call somebody that starts calling other people names, when those other people are being civil and not calling people names?

I dont mean to ping-pong this conversation (and I realize it borders on the inane), but I’d sincerely like to able to understand your perspective on this behavior.

Rottenclam
Rottenclam
11 years ago

@Jack – thank you for summarizing / sharing your perspective. It makes perfect sense, and I can appreciate your approach on this particular context.

As for somebody coming around with a different handle, and starting trouble – yeah, I’ve seen that many times (and even a few times on here). I totally understand why, every day, you have to be somewhat hawkish about that behavior happening here in the comments (you just never know if that knucklehead is going to come back and what new form he will take). Very annoying, I’m sure.

I appreciate your responses to me, and again, I do appreciate the article you wrote above. Be well.

George
George
11 years ago

@ Jack

I just listened to Episode 858 (Lierre Keith) this morning, and a question popped in my head. Then you did this post, and since it is much more recent, and related to paleo, I figured I would ask here.

If grains are not the best foods for a paleo diet or your ruminants, and everything has a purpose, what is the purpose of grains? If not for food, then how do they help in gardening, besides maybe as cover crops and mulch?

Thank you for your time.

Norcal Mike
Norcal Mike
11 years ago
Reply to  George

Grains are seeds, seeds are bird food.

George
George
11 years ago
Reply to  Norcal Mike

That makes sense. Thank you.

George
George
11 years ago

Thank you for your response. I tried buckwheat last year, and it is quite a bit of work to go from plant to table. But it is wonderful at reseeding itself! And the bees love all of those flowers.

After hearing you talk so highly of amaranth, and watching your video on the harvesting process, I thought I would try it this year. Due to working so much this year, I didn’t get to plant my amaranth in time for seed production. I will plant some for greens this week and save the rest of the seed for next year.

I like the idea of sprouting, but have never done it. I like them on my salad and can only imagine how much better they are fresh. I will try them in the spare bedroom with the door shut. I don’t trust the cats not to get into things when I am at work.

I only have a small area in which to grow grains of any kind, but I love the nastalgic feeling of getting out there with my sickle and harvesting them. Since I currently have no animals except two cats, it is nice to have some ideas that are not so “unhealthy” for me to use the little that I do grow.

I will be moving to a much larger plot of land within the next couple of years (financial issues at the moment) and was wanting to find a way to still keep that old time harvesting feeling. I guess I will keep it to a smaller crop. Or make sure to do everything by hand, which is my preference anyway. I would just hate to do all that work, just to give it to the birds, when they are fine with stealing it right off the plant.

Thanks again.

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago

oh I see, I didn’t know Jack and Steve have history and are friends. I’m new here.

George
George
11 years ago

@ Laaz2750,

Steven Harris and Jack are friends. Steven Richards is not Steven Harris. Those are two different people. I hope that clears up your confusion. When Jack says that Steve is a bigger dick than he is, he is referring to his friend Steven Harris who has been on the show numerous times and is a member of the expert panel for the call in shows.

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago
Reply to  George

Thanks for the clarification. Back to the topic for a second (which I probably shouldn’t have strayed from in the first place 🙂 ) Jack can you recommend a sweetener for coffee? Pretty hard to choose between sugar, which I know is bad for me, and all the chemical sugar alternatives, which I suspect are bad for me in different ways.

Steven Richards
11 years ago

Effects of stevia, aspartame, and sucrose on food intake, satiety, and postprandial glucose and insulin levels – http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20303371

Laaz2750
Laaz2750
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

cool!

Hraz
Hraz
11 years ago
Reply to  Laaz2750

I’ve been drinking what is called Bulletproof Coffee in the morning, which is coffee blended with grass fed butter and MCT oil. It keeps me full until lunch and it tastes really good. You can get Kerry Gold Irish butter at Trader Joe’s for $2.99.

shane
shane
11 years ago

Steven Richards, Awesome to see another guy that read Carb Backloading. I did not read all 80 some odd posted, but did see jack may not have gotten your post completely. I have read both robb wolfs book and John Kiefers book. Both books are solid. How I see it, eating paleo is great for the majority of the population. If you are lifting hard eating paleo in a CBL method is probably the best way to do it. Jack if you have time check out Kiefer books Carb Nite, and Carb Backloading. His books are about 200 pages and 50 pages of citations. He and robb have been on each others podcast and agree about a lot.

shane
shane
11 years ago
Reply to  shane

I just hate to see a good book, and a researcher that I respect, possibly discredited because of poor delivery.

Brian
Brian
11 years ago

So where is this eat, don’t eat, eat in moderation list you talked about? I went to the MSB back office to read the book, but kept getting a “404 not found” when I click on download.

Steven Harris
11 years ago

Ok…lets be clear here… I just got notified of this ‘conversation.’ Steven Harris talks about ENERGY… I don’t delve into paleo and such. I do food storage talks too…but not nutrition and the way you guys do diet.

if there is a STEVE talking about something OTHER than Energy… ITS NOT ME !!!

Steven E Harris . The E stands for Electrified !!! 98% of the time. 2% of the time it might be Egotistical, but that sure as hell bests being indecisive. Sometimes I am wrong, and when I am… you’ll hear about it from ME.

Mark
Mark
11 years ago

This person is talking with limited understanding of the diet and is short sighted in their theory. Paleo is not a low carb diet, and he downplays the anti inflammatory effects of not eating grains or dairy.

This is what happens when someone who read the Atkins diet book reads Dr oz’s synopsis on paleo.