What No One Will Say About the Connecticut School Shootings — 86 Comments

    • In a school setting parents rely on school staff to protect their children. In a high school setting there is more of a factor of free will vs. a elementary school setting where children are demanded/forced to comply.
      expecting a elementary student to be aware or whether they are running into or away from danger is not reasonable.

        • Indeed they do not. They are mostly Liberals and believe in the Brotherhood of Man. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but they are really not the right person for being Warriors. Changing situations requires a mental gear shift at light speed, if not warp 5. Those of us who are trained and experienced at doing that tend to not be hired by schools. Our mindset scares the straights 😉 And we refuse to wear the symbolic noose which is the necktie of slaves.

        • I don’t know that I agree with you, Cryptozoic. The “warrior” point is a bit moot, as the citizens have decided to prevent teachers from being armed on school property. As much as I always wanted to be independent and self-sufficient, it would have done little good if it led to my firing and possible arrest. I have known other gun owners who were teachers, and even a few teachers with prior military experience.
          The reality is probably that the school district’s legal representation has told the administrators that it incurs less liability to do little and not “make a mistake” than it does to take definitive action using the information available at the time and potentially incur additional casualties as a result of said action. Very unfortunate, really.

        • What is more important, making the lawyers and insurance companies happy or protecting the kids?

  1. You are right on the money with this discussion Jack! My family was discussing this over the weekend and came to the conclusion that hiding in the hazard zone is the wrong approach to take. We live in Colorado and Columbine happened when my kids were school age. The day that happened we discussed what they should do if a similar event happened at their school and hiding in the school was not the right approach. I told them flat out, even if the teachers tell you otherwise if you can safely get out of the school building do it immediately and run away as fast as you can.
    Thanks for confirming our approach to surviving these kinds of attacks.

  2. You are exactly correct. My guess is that the reason these kids had so many bullet wounds was because they were gathered closely together. Most people get their weapons knowledge from Hollywood where bullets never pass though bodies or go through walls and doors. Hence we have the lock down. The fact that there have been no mention of any men on the campus tells me this was a super soft target. The shooter knew, there’s no one there armed and there’s no one there that might be capable of over powering him.

      • Our CFO and his assistant were in a a meeting in Tower Two in the Oppenheimer Funds office (somewhere above floor #100 IIRC) when the first tower was hit. They started down the steps and ignored an “all clear and return to your office” announcement while in the stairwell (between the 20th and 30th floor IIRC). The second plane hit their tower when they were on the 4th floor. They had to dodge debris once they made it out then they made a run for their lives when the first tower fell and again when the second tower fell. There is a reason we have the SURVIVAL instinct to leave when there is danger and we should not train anyone to “stay put” when every fiber in your body is telling to “get out”.

  3. One of three actions should be considered for an active shooter incident – 1. run if possible (doors, windows, shooter not in sight but can hear shots); 2. if not possible to leave, lock/barricade door(s) between you and shooter, make no noise, turn off lights (thought is maybe room is not in use); 3. if shooter enters, mass attack by throwing books, objects in room while others fight for gun, knife, etc. Some will die or be injured but at least others will survive.

    • I like the first two ideas, but the 3rd would be better as a surprise attack, if the school is locked down, no-one should be allowed to enter a room until an all clear or code has been given. The teacher should have a large object or a weapon that if the door came open and someone popped through it, they would be knocked out or dis-armed. Surprise and a defensive positions are very powerful.

  4. We need to arm teachers just like we do our pilots as well as harden all school doors. Since doing those 2 steps not a single hijacking has occurred in US. Go figure…

    • I hear what your saying MmmBBQ, but it would be difficult if not impossible to get parents on board with that idea. Why not go part way and “arm” teachers with pepper spray or a stun gun? There would be more opportunity I think to implement something like that.

      Of course we all know that a gun trumps pepper spray, but at least it is something, to fight with!

        • The Texas school implemented the policy shortly after the Virginia Tech shooting when the administration realized that they were a good 20 minutes from a sheriff arriving if an incident occurs.
          Here in Ohio there are discussions within the state government and the attorney general stating that he would not be opposed to arming properly trained teachers. Numerous gun clubs including mine are looking to offer free classes to local teachers. Only time will tell, but perhaps at least some states will do the right thing instead of the knee jerk thing, this time around.

      • its hard to say pepper spray or a stun gun would make things worse because the perp is there to do as much damage as possible. Even vests are no real benefit. but guns on campus in hands of people that we can not control how much training they have is INSAIN.

        • ray,
          I agree with you that “guns on campus in hands of people that we cannot control how much training they have is INSAIN.” And that is why we specify a certain minimum amount of training to carry on a school campus. Easy solution.

      • I agree that the pacifists in this country will never go for the solution that will work, but pepper spray is better than nothing.

    • The problem with those two less-than-lethal options of that you have to be considerably closer to the enemy to deploy them, esp. in the case of a “stun gun” or Taser. The other obvious problem is the disparity of force needed to stop an attack. When confronted with deadly force, the only effective means you have to counter is most likely deadly force itself. Anything less is wholly ineffective and will do little to stop or deter the threat.

  5. Well said Jack i often wonder where the minds of the authorities are at. Those that make some of these idiotic rules do not seem to live in the real world. Unfortunately the creator holds no favorites, my prayers go out to the families..

  6. The video from Huston is great I will be showing it to my friends.
    I fear no single plan would work in every situation. Had there been a shooter in the treeline waiting for people to run, as was the case in Jonesboro.
    I did read in one account the teacher had kids hide in cabinets, and closets. That seems a better idea than lining them up against the wall, at least until LEO arrives and tries to get them all out of the room quickly.
    With knowledge not available to those in the situation (that there was only one shooter, and direction of travel) , it is easy to say “you should have run”. Much harder call without that information.

    I have the feeling next time this happens teachers will fight back, just like airline passengers do now.
    Every classroom has a fire extinguisher, when they open the door spray ’em, then hit ’em with the empty.

    Run. Hide. Fight.

  7. The concern I have is that it keeps happening (probably always will) so not sure what the right answer. Hindsight is always much better than in the moment.

  8. Hard to watch admittedly. The sadness of a nation is apparent even 16000 Km’s away. Some good sense on these comments. Post ops are always the most valuable insight going forward.
    May peace and good will prevail on this our earthy world!

  9. It was accurate and balanced. I cannot see anyone taking offense to what was outlined in the video Jack. The point of “We cannot prevent it from happening again” is particularly true. There is evil out there and mitigating it’s effect is each and everyone’s responsibility. Once again, preparedness rings true. We cannot choose our disaster.

  10. your common sense aproach is great but most people would call you a nut job because most people today do not have 2 brain cells to rub together. lack morals and brains has been train into most people big business with heart less politscians. guns have change in many years but people have greedy and mindless sheeple. do not forget big pharma, more drugs make it better, not!

  11. Thank you Jack, every word spoken is true and needed to be heard no matter how much it hurts to hear it… Just my two cents.

  12. You nailed it Jack. One other thing we should be teaching our faculty and students is emergency medicine. We need to get IFAKs with tourniquets and hemostatic agents into the schools.


  13. Has anyone considered pepper spray? As soon as you get some on the pos, he is down for the count.

    Or has the govt made pepper spray a felony on school grounds…………

  14. In the 50’s, it was “Duck and cover!” to “protect” us from nuclear blasts. Now we laugh at that, but back then, the guv’ment was serious and expected kids to comply! I clearly remember getting out of my desk chair and crawling down under the desk where I obediently put my little hands over my head. That provided nothing, except an illusion that the guv’ment was taking care of me. It’s all control and illusion.

  15. After hearing this I immediately called my sons principal (with a little righteous anger) and asked him to describe his school’s active shooter plan, and boy am I glad I did! After talking to him I feel I must give a loving rebuke to you and this audience, Jack. I mean no disrespect to anyone; finding this podcast has been a great thing in my life. But I think we are armchair quarterbacking a bad situation none of us I imagine are close to (unless you have kids at that school). Please, every parent call your child’s teacher or principal and ask them to explain their active shooter plan to you. I’m sure some may have a bad one, but I found the one at my son’s school to be well reasoned given the nature of these type of events (and yes, it is very similar to the plan that was in place at sandy hook). I even asked him why they wouldn’t evacuate when the school was a single story and every classroom had fire egress doors or windows at least. He responded that there were so many “what if” scenarios that no one could ever succed in planning for all of them (second shooter in the woods next to playground, on the roof, in a car outside waiting to hose em all down as they ran out, etc, etc, etc). The simplest plan they could have is to lock the doors, draw shades, turn off lights, keep the children out of sight—and then action from there would be sitationally dependent and up to the judgement of the teachers in their individual rooms. If the teacher felt it would be safer to leave than stay put, they could. The main goal was to prevent chaos. All this lines up with what I know of tactical situations from my years as an army infantryman. The simplest plans are usually best, the best decisions are made by the men closest to the situation, and no plan survives first contact with the enemy. After talking to the principal I feel they have the best plan possible given the fluid and unpredictable nature of these types of events, and that perhaps the only thing that can be done is to give more training and mindset preparedness for these teachers. I feel that perhaps thinking that such a thing as what happened Friday would never happen to their class is what caused those teachers to not go beyond the “stay in the classroom” step of the drill. They may have been stuck in the “this can’t be happening, I don’t know what to do” stage. But now I’m armchair quarterbacking. In summation, the sandy hook massacre is one unique situation, most of whose participants are gone; and we outside the situation have very few facts and insights about. It is impossible for us to say what did, let alone what should have happened. And it doesn’t make a hill o beans of difference to that incident what we think should have happened. All we can do is ask each other what can we do to prevent this from happening to my child’s school? Start by asking what plan is in place at your child’s school, and then how can that plan be made better. I like the idae of armed teachers, whether letally or less lethally. Realize though, that one can never fully prepare for the unexpected. After I got done talking with the principal, I told my son to listen to what his teacher told him to do, but if he felt that he was in immediate danger ( shooter in the room he’s in, etc) it was better to run or fight than wait to be killed. Again, I have great respect for you and this community. I felt this needed to be said.

    • Let me tell you I am not arm chair quarterbacking. The first rule in a combat situation is GET OFF THE X, this is taught to every solider, every police officer and in any creditable tactical course you will ever take.

      Let me explain what happens when what if results in just hunker down, it gets you killed. Luby’s Cafeteria in the 80s, why was that lady alive to testify in front of congress? Because she got the hell out.

      I am sorry but hide and wait when someone is trying to kill you in general gets you dead, tune in tomorrow and I will talk a bit about the “what ifs”.

      But please think back to your training in the Army because what you are defending right not is 100% counter to it, 100%.

  16. I have noticed a city police car daily at the high school
    for a few years now. I tried to engage in a conversation
    regarding another subject involving students and teachers
    and it was like pulling teeth. Our cops in this town are not
    freindly at all so I stay away from them. The bad thing
    about this latest shooting is the copy-cats will come out of
    the woodwork but I hope not.

  17. Yeah… We should talk about these so called active shooter plans. I work for a government agency (I know… I know…) and in my federal drone filled building we have done these drills where you run and hide as a herd of potential victims in centrally located rooms with only one way in/out, like the restrooms, and storage areas. If you we’re a nut job, this would be like Christmas morning… Oh look, a bunch of disarmed cattle waiting to be slaughtered. They wouldn’t even need to open the door, as all the cube farm walls are hollow… I personally plan to stay out of the active shooter gathering areas because I don’t want to be another easy target… This kind of thinking is incredibly dangerous and L.E. will never be there in time to help you if you are just huddling with the other drones waiting to die. Also, the fact that we are not allowed to be armed in the fed center means that these incidents are inevitable and will only end in mass death. I am sure this is how they train kids and teachers too…

  18. Jack,
    I am currently in my second year of teaching. I teach high school and as a result, my students knew more about the shooting than I did by time I started my last period class on Friday. My students asked what I thought about it and I think I surprised them. I’m sure they expected me to say something generic like, “that will never happen here” or “our school is safer than most other schools.” I told them it terrified me. This is my biggest fear as a teacher. I then told them why. I have my CCL and I carry everywhere except school. I told them that anywhere but here, where they should be safest I can’t protect them. I let them know I would do everything in my power to protect them, but if a person with a gun walks into my room there is little I can do if they want to kill us. Each year at the beginning of the year we review our drills for emergencies and each year I have been bothered by the “stay put and wait for help” strategy. After talking to several other teachers, we plan on bringing up the possibility for teachers to carry in school (with appropriate training of course) with the school board. We are a very rural school and it would be difficult, but we have a possibility of succeeding. I truly do believe that the reason schools are always such easy targets is because we’re considered soft targets. “Crazies” know that they will have little to no opposition. These people are cowards, they don’t want people that can fight back, they want victims. We have to change that way of thinking. Hopefully my school can become an example for others.

    As always, thanks for your honesty and insight, Jack. It is much appreciated.

  19. Jack,
    I am pretty disappointed with a lot of the commentary you made in this video. This incident obviously bothered you as it did anyone with a heart. However, I think some of your conclusions and possible solutions are shortsighted.

    First, your brutal criticism of the principal and the teacher who were killed is pretty unjust. If their actions saved just one life, then yes, they are heroes. If a grenade falls into a fox hole and a soldier jumps on it to save a friend, isn’t he a hero? Abolutely!! If you are walking down the concourse of the mall with your wife and shots ring out, would you just stand there in the open and try to take on the shooter? Or would your first your first instinct be to protect your wife? Would you protect her with your own body and get her out or to cover before addressing the threat? There is no doubt in my mind that you would protect her with your body because it is natural to protect those you love, just as the principal and teacher did. They could have just stood there and been shot, like sheep, or did something to save themselves, but they didn’t. They did their best to help those they love when the chips were down.

    Second, you say get out at all cost because locking down a room is ineffective. In some cases, evacuating may be the answer. But to infer, or even outright declare that it is the only answer is absurd. You mentioned being able to get through a classroom door fairly easily. Have you ever breached a typical door on a classroom? I have and it’s not as easy as it sounds, unless the door is made primarily of glass. Most classroom doors are heavy wood, steel or a combination of them. During a training exercise, I used a 60# ram and had to hit many of the doors 2 and 3 times to get them open. Standard commercial deadbolts were the only locks on the doors. Also, these doors could be reenforced if you were to take two of the standard wooden door stops/props and drive them under the bottom of the door. Connect some rope between the two stops and it will be easier to pull the stops out when it is safe to do so. Using the nail pulling end of a standard claw hammer and hooking the connecting rope is an easy way to remove the stops. With a small amount of practice, these stops could be inserted and removed fairly quickly. Once they are in place, the only way into the room is to chop your way through the door or blow the hinges off.

    Third, there absolutely are things that can be done to mitigate, and even pretty much eliminate these kinds of attacks. First way is to cut the press coverage. Attention, even after death, is what these cowards seek. The attackers at Columbine wanted to be on the cover of TIME magazine and they made it. If I remember correctly, they were on it twice. We know for a fact that their attack and the subsequent coverage inspired the attacker at Virginia Tech. He made it his goal to beat the body count at Columbine and unfortuantely, he did.

    The other thing we can do is arm AND train teachers and staff whom are willing and committed. This is what is done in Israel and there are very few attacks on schools there. I know that the culture and compulsary military service there plays somewhat of a role but, these attackers want a body count. If they are stopped quickly, then they know that the body count that they desire is not obtainable and will choose other, softer targets instead.

    There are still a lot of unaswered questions about this attack and it is premature to pass much judgement on those in the school. I will see the after action reports and study them as I have other such incidents. For me, it’s not about why these cowards attack innocents because evil is evil. For me, it’s about how could I intervene, on and off-duty, during such an incident and how I can help prepare others to do so if they so choose.

    • Nothing I said was brutal criticism of either the principle or the teacher, it was JUST HONEST, that is all. I said the woman acted with heroic intent but that intent doesn’t mean you accomplish anything. She didn’t, all she did was add herself to the body count.

      All these put in a ballistic door ideas and everything else require time and funding, making an evac plan and AS I SAID knowing every situation is different in the video, DID YOU HEAR THAT PART and giving teachers more then one option (stay, pray and wait for death) is a much better and a doable plan, we can start doing it right now.

      Like I said I will talk about a lot of the “what ifs” today.

      On arming teachers, great idea, I LOVE IT, guess what, IT AIN’T GOING TO HAPPEN at least on a large scale.

  20. I’m a school superintendent who has developed a “plan” for the District. Because our District is within 40 minutes of an army post, I was able to get military expertise in its development. Security keeps me from being totally forthcoming about all its details, because terrorism is also included as a concern (being so near the Post) but all staff know where to take students for meet-ups off campus and how to communicate with unknowns.

    We have security drills just like we have tornado drills and fire drills.
    I don’t believe in making children afraid of what could happen. But, by giving children a “plan” it empowers them. They have some knowledge of where to go and how to react. I believe that making them a part of the drill makes them stronger.

    Here is the hard part.
    No plan can keep out a killer who intends to kill himself as well as everyone else. For one thing it is very difficult to defend against “crazy.”
    For another, the law says I can’t be armed on school property.
    I can have my plans in place and be constantly aware of what is going on around the campus, but it is extremely difficult if not impossible to defend against a kamikaze crazy person.

    I think the general public would be amazed how often, I personally, have been threatened. It happens all the time to school personnel.

    As an educator I am very proud and very non-surprised at the Sandy Hook staff throwing themselves in the line of fire to protect the children. Almost every teacher and administrator I know would do the same. What an amazing group of people.

    I take school violence and death on campus very seriously and very personally. About 15 years ago, I had to run a morgue out of my office after a natural disaster destroyed much of the community and rescue workers could not get in. Of course, man’s inhumanity to man is so much worse, but as soon as I heard the news of the horrific event, I could immediately smell the blood of my memories.

    With all that said, you are right about a school’s disaster plan. Sadly, while many schools do have something in place, many do not, because of the normalcy bias, “Hasn’t ever happened here, so it won’t”
    That’s stupidity.

    Enough of my rambling. I thought you might be interested in what an actual blue-hair old lady school official has done to protect her children.
    Thanks for your passion and good work.

    • Kate,

      I appreciate your efforts. I am chief of security and emergency planning at a large urban district in Virginia. I have put together information that my Supt. is sending to all staff on Jan. 2 when we come back from break that changes the face of “lockdown” and encourages such things as barricading doors with flipped over desks and telling teachers that we trust them to use their best judgment so they can take action on thier own without waiting for the principal and to think first about breaking a window to flee with their children to safety if there is an iminent threat in the building. I’ve shared it with family and friend educators across the country and if you email me at, I’d be happy to send it to you from my work email. I’d also be glad to talk to you or any of your staff if I can be of any assistance.

  21. Being in a room almost full of ditto’s. Again I call out ‘Monday morning quarter backing’ on a ‘Monday night’ .

    If schools have a lock down procedure. It does not change the fact that in a real world situation, NO ONE KNOWS, if staying locked down or running away is the right thing to do in any particular situation ( because you don’t know if you are running into more danger or away …). But, what they do know is that there will be Some that listen to the authorities in control and Some that will take control in their hands and run according to what They have been told.

    So what have I just said? Well, for the benefit of those who (Do not) have a glass too full to learn something new is.

    What this allows for is a potential 50/50 situation that allows for situational change so People do choose to run or lock down as they are inclined. (high school or elementary school in example)

    Therefore if they perceive danger or lack of trust in leadership they have free will to choose.

    • This is my entire point Ray the problem is these schools have absolutely NO PLAN other then lock down. With the right shooters that is nothing but a death sentence.

  22. Took a lot to watch it through. Not because the topic is difficult, but instead because the commentary was inappropriate.

    Yeah, I understand the idea of getting off the x. But think about the context. 20-30 5 and 6 year olds. Much more easily said than done.

    Dawn Hochsprung is a hero. According to your definition of hero Jack, no one should have climbed down the cargo netting on D-Day. That was a full frontal assault on a heavily fortified beach. Those silly soldiers. If only they would have selfishly thought of themselves…

    12-14-12 was Dawn’s D-day she did the best she could with the tools and training that she had. I wish she would have had more of both, but instead of worrying about that, she acted. We will never quantify the lives she saved.

    Please keep up the good work, I just don’t think this video was part of the good stuff.

  23. Jack,

    there is news that the mother of the Connecticut killer <> and took his son to shooting lessons. (source)
    How do you think this info will affect the prepper community image?

    • The Daily Mail is not a valid news source they are a tabloid. Unless this gets some traction in the main stream news it won’t mean a damn thing. I think they will make more over the fact that this woman was a “gun enthusiast” then anything else. The best thing we can do about this Daily Mail crap is ignore it, unless it gets wider acceptance it is meaningless, all fighting it does is give it legitimacy, that is why I have ignored it.

  24. “mother talk about how her six year old son survived the terrible shooting tragedy at Sandy Hook Elementary School. She had always told him if someone comes into the school with a gun he should run away.

    This advice probably saved her son’s life. The shooter came into the classroom, standing at the door and shot this child’s teacher. The six year old, rather than hiding in the classroom or just staring in shock, had the presence of mind to follow his mother’s advice and ran for the door, running past the shooter still standing there.

  25. I’m not a brain development expert, but I do not think children (in the United States, at least) have developed the “fight or flight” response by age 5 to 7. If left to their own devices children of this age will, as sad as it sounds, simply get low and cover their eyes/head with their hands.

    I understand that the children in CT likely did not even have time to run, especially in the first room. It breaks my heart to even run the scenarios through my head. My God, these were babies.

    I have two very small children and I will make it my goal to teach them early that the need to run. Kids are quick, really quick, and I think we need to use that quickness and condition them to have different reflexes in dangerous situations.

    • The Chinese book of war talks about the Thirty-Six Stratagems. It is being study in the U.S military (some branches, might not be all branches).

      The one we often heard used as a colloquial is, “There’s thirty six strategies, running or retrieving is the best strategy.”

      I put a link here for you.

      Jack is right. Run away unless you can take down the attacker. No one will say your child is a coward. We were always taught when there’s a problem, run as fast as you can away.

  26. I am trying, unsuccessfully, to envision a scenario where “GET OUT NOW” isn’t the best default strategy instead of “sit quietly and hope the killer doesn’t come to you”.

    EVEN IF there’s a second shooter outside, aren’t your chances much better outside where there are cars, trees, fences, dumpsters, and multiple possible routes away from the threat(s) than locked in a classroom where there is no cover and no means of escape (the whole class can’t jump out the window once the guy is standing at the door).

    Now of course you can dream up scenarios where staying inside would the right move, this is why anyone in such a situation needs to THINK and evaluate their situation rather than mindlessly follow a predetermined script. But it seems to me the best default strategy to give the staff is:

    1) Get away from the known threat
    2) Move quickly to one of several meet up locations off-campus (preferably somewhere with lots of people)
    3) Stay alert for additional dangers and be prepared to modify or abandon this plan if necessary

    • Now to be fair it may not always be my point though is, shouldn’t we at least a a get the hell out plan?

      On the second shooter the example everyone is given is Jonesboro Arkansas. Here is the problem with that example, it isn’t how it happened. The memory people have seems to be contorted and confused.

      Here is what happened in Jonesboro, the two shooters loaded up and set up what can only be called a snipers nest. Once that was done shooter 1 did enter the school but did so with out firing a shot. He calmly walked in and pulled a FIRE ALARM, and then calmly walked out and backed off to his chosen firing point. The two shooters waited until a large crowd was assembled and then opened fire.

      We learn two things here…

      1. Lock down would have never worked because the students and teachers were attacked outside the school

      2. Killers like their targets in small areas and they like the stationary

      So my point is when ever possible is you are those under your watch become targets the two things you don’t want is them in a high density situation and you don’t want them stationary.

  27. I agree with you Jack, arming teachers will not happen.
    Heck, one of my kindergarten teachers had to cut some gum caught up in a child’s hair. Her parents came to the Board trying to get her fired for assaultl with a deadly weapon! I had to hire a lawyer to defend the teacher.
    That’s nuts. But that is the mindset of many folks – like legislators!
    I think that during professional development, training should be provided for teachers how to handle the worst of these situations, just like there is training for AIDS prevention, CPR, and, oh yeah, improving teaching skills.
    Still, like I said earlier, it is difficult to defend against Kamikaze Crazy.

  28. Excellent video Jack. I am going to talk to my kids at dinner at tonight and, tell to them to evacuate instead of stay put and be quiet when there is an active shooter. I suggest for all the teachers/administrators who have CCW licenses to carry anyway. Concealed is concealed. Downsize to a smaller gun (J-Frame, Kel-Tec P3AT, Kahr PM9, Kel-Tec PF9, etc.) if need be.

  29. Here is a perspective on the principal’s action that needs to be considered. She probably knew that her actions were relatively futile, but she also knew that police were on the way and she wanted to do something to slow down the shooter. Her action caused the shooter to spend time dealing with her, rather than moving on to the next target. Had there been enough people able to do the same, the shooter might have run out of time to reach classrooms before police arrived.

    • PaCoTx,
      How much time did it really cost the shooter. Sorry, but as unfeeling as it may sound, I agree with Jack on this one. If she actually had used a weapon such as a ball bat, etc. and actually cost the shooter some real time in a real fight, then I might agree with you; but rushing a shooter who guns you down is nothing more than a mere speed bump.

  30. Prioror to hearing this I had the exact same conversation with my 15 year old girl. Make sure she knew where the exits were at each class she’s in and every class room where a heavy object is to break glass if need be. It amazes me to think that every school in this nation has the same emergency plan. I’m going to make a move towards our school board to deputize teachers, and get past the thought of signs and zones stop people with this mind set.

  31. Just sent it to my local sheriff with some explanation. Here in my part of Virgnia our schools have armed deputies. When one of our past school board members requested that the deputies be unarmed while in our schools the sheriff refused to place deputies in schools unarmed. I believe this was after the Va Tech shooting.

  32. My son was attending the Naval Academy when the Va Tech shooting occured. He stated that he couldn’t be sure if the shooter had come to the Naval Academy if he would have killed more or less students but the shooter would not had a docile targets. Books, laptops, chairs, desks would have rained on the shooter. Just a differnent school mentality.

  33. Comparison and contrast.. Paraphrasing media, “A 20 year old man today legally obtained guns for the purposes of self defense and killed is mother and then shot up a school.” “Because these were legally obtained weapons should we have stricter gun control laws, experts say yes”

    Possible alternate news cast, “A 20 year old man turned criminal today and stole his mothers guns and ammo killing his mother and then shot up a school of children and teachers where his mother had been working as substitute teacher.” “Because a criminal used illegally obtained guns and ammo should we arm the teachers with small pistols with laser grips such as .38 or even .22 longs at least, even a frail woman can stand to shoot .22 long and with 2 to 3 shots take defend herself and students, experts say yes.”

  34. Yes I did hear every part of your video and have read all the comments posted by you and others. I agree with you that there is times when running away is the best option and we should be teaching evacuation options to the students and the staff. I also agree with you that the shooting at Jonesboro is not comparable to this, or even most other incidents, and they should not be compared.

    Looking at the hundreds of these types of incidents that have happened world wide over the past several years, there are two interesting statistics that should drive our thinking and preparations: 98% of the attackers were alone and of the 2% that were multiple attackers, the attackers stayed within a short distance of each other. So, if the attacker enters one end of the school, the children at the other end do statistically have a chance to get away without being harmed. But me personally, I see validity in having the classrooms close to the attack going into lockdown, especially if they do have the heavier doors that I mentioned in my previous post. Classroom doors could also have reenforcement on the doors, such as a cross bar, like the doors leading to the cockpit of a commercial airliner.

    Arming teachers and staff is absolutely the best answer, but you are right…it probably won’t happen on a large scale. What parents, administrators, and anyone else opposed to arming teachers refuse to acknowledge is that seconds = body count, not minutes. One recent stat I read a short time ago said that the average police response time in the US has gone from 3-5 minutes to 9-11 minutes nationwide. The attacker at the theatre in Colorado injured or killed 70 people in 7 minutes…10 casualties per minute! 9-11 minutes waiting for police to arrive while someone is shooting at you is a long, long, long time.

    I see where you are interviewing Rory Miller on today’s show. He is someone that I greatly admire and I am downloading that episode to my ipod now.

    Even though I disagree with some of the points that you made in your video, I still appreciate what you do and the valuable information that you provide on your website every day.

  35. There are some reports of a teacher helping kids escape out a window, but the details are thin at best at this time.

  36. Thank you Jack. I have contacted my children’s school district demanding a revision in their current lock down policy for active shooters. I suggested the evacuation method. So your message did not go in vein Jack.

  37. I spoke to my 6 year old grand daughter the day of the shooting. I told her to pick up a chair and break a window if she needed to in order to get away from the situation, even if her teacher told her not to. I tried to instill the thought of her getting away as fast as possible.
    I have not had a chance to speak to my 10 year old grandson, but plan to this weekend.
    I did tell my husband what I had told my grand daughter and I could tell he was not quite happy with what I said. I am going to insist that he watch this video this evening when he comes home so he can help me to teach the grand kids survival mindset.
    My son, their father, has a knack of being able to walk into a room and determine security issues and escape routes. I am also going to speak with him as soon as possible to encourage him the teach his children the same mind set.
    My youngest son was still at home when Columbine occurred. I was saddened to have to have the security conversation with him, but as a parent, I felt it was my responsibility.
    Times have changed dramatically. Don’t put your head in the sand, hoping that your children will be safe. Be proactive and teach them to be safe. You don’t have to make them fearful of life to be successful in this. Just teach them to be aware. Teach them to be proactive in their own safety. Someone else is likely not going to be able to do it for them.

  38. I like the video that Kerry posted. I did have the strong desire to knock out the noisy, panicking woman just so she wouldn’t draw any more attention to that group.

  39. In my opinion….Love the show and love the community but this video is completely pointless. To armchair quarterback a situation as tragic as this is completely arrogant. Nothing about this video needed to be said and accomplishes very little except to be inflammatory. If you where there and actually knew what happened then you would have the right to criticize the teachers response. I am not sure if you are being intentionally inflammatory but this video accomplishes very little. If your goal is to improve the repose plans for schools and other organizations then I agree but go about it a little more tactfully than this. Again, love the show.

        • @Justin, EXACTLY, thanks for making my point for me. You have no facts, I do, you seem to have no experience, I do.

          So the only other thing is you claimed I criticized the teachers response, I didn’t, I criticized the policy that led to their response.

          I am sorry Justin but Plan A hide and Plan B die is far from the best we can do. If you knew what real armchair quarterbacking was (guess you never played football either and watched game tapes) you would know it is exactly what we need right now. We need to be honest about everything that was done wrong and everything that could have gone worse and ask how to build contingency for it.

          Our quest for heroes in everything and or desire to see something good in all tragedies should not get in the way of being HONEST, USING FACT and PROTECTING FUTURE LIVES.

          To be blunt if this makes me the most hated man in America but saves one kid who is told, “run” by his parents I will sleep well at night. BTW someone did tell their kid to run and it saved their life in CT. Listen to the next days show and LEARN

    • OK not going to get into trading barbs back and forth through blog. This is a community and I thought criticism would be more welcome. Again not arguing with what you were trying to accomplish but I feel like your point is overshadowed but the inflammatory nature of your comments. With statements such as “teachers did not keep them safe” portrays that you have some intimate knowledge of what went on there. Blanket statements like that are ridiculous when there are reports that one teacher hid all of her students and when the gunman came in she told them that they were in the gym. He then shot her. That is a hero in my book! Again, I wasn’t there so I don’t know exactly what happened but neither were you. Using statements like “what should they have done” is where my armchair QB comment comes from and I don’t think my football experience is very relevant here but whatever.

      I’m not going to get into some pissing match here about who has more experience because that comment just shows me that you are missing my point. My point is that your video doesn’t accomplish what you intended and it comes off pretty arrogant. The message could have been stated much more tactfully and the point would have gotten through. Again, I agree with your point just not your delivery. When a situation like this happens it is an excellent time to reflect on what we can do better next time but not on the failings of the people who experienced it.

  40. Oh no – Jack is starting to think like a bureaucrat! I was sent the link to an Independent Study course from FEMA titled Active Shooter: What You Can Do. Turns out the official FEMA course instruction follows the theme of the Houston video of Run, Hide, Fight. In fact, it appears the Houston video was created as an outgrowth of this training module:

    Someone at FEMA had their act together here – getting away is usually the best first answer. Now if the media would just understand!

  41. Remember the old Kung Fu TV series?
    Grasshopper asks what is the preferred method of dealing with force?
    Teacher says ” Since we prefer peace and quiet above victory, there is a simple and preferred method: Run away.”

    Later (or earlier) on in the series, Grasshopper asks why, since we are priests, do we study the martial arts? Answer: First you must learn how to survive.

    Indeed it is a harsh world out there in the jungle. One must be as harmless as a teddy bear and, at need, know how to, and be able to, be merciless.
    I offer you Col. Kurtz:
    Horror and moral terror must be your friends, otherwise they are enemies to be feared.
    I have not gone over the edge, but I know how to do it. I’m keeping it in reserve, because good men (and women) need to know how to …. do that.

  42. I’m a teacher of 10+ years who is now in the private sector (I say this only to qualify that I have spent a lot of time in schools and am very familiar with typical school policy). I believe Jack’s point is very much correct. There are some additional responsibilities in the creation of these plans that I believe many school districts miss.

    The first, as Jack stated, is to empower the teachers to make a decision as to what is best, with the preferred option being to escape at the first prudent opportunity.

    The other is to develop a plan based upon the architecture of their specific school buildings. Some schools have been designed with the philosophy that there should be an emergency exit door in every or ever-other classroom. In these buildings, sheltering-in-place is almost always foolish, as an means of escape is readily available. Other schools have been designed so that there are a few large emergency exits to accommodate large numbers of people exiting, but there are not individual exits in each classroom (this is thought to be easier to secure at night, etc.). These are the difficult ones, as the one must traverse more open hallways to escape.

    It is the communities of taxpayers that must demand that (public) schools move on making these difficult decisions and plans. I hate to make broad generalizations, but your “best” (subjective term, I realize) teachers either remain teachers for their entire career (they like it and excel at it), or they become frustrated with the bureaucracy and leave the profession. They often do not become school administrators. I say this to emphasize that we are foolish to expect very many school administrators to come to the best conclusion by themselves.

    Please demand that your local schools put actual thought into this and make intelligent preparations if they haven’t already.

  43. To me, clearly the answer is protecting the kids. However, management may (usually does) feel differently. Be a tough guy and tell management to “shove it?” Sounds great. Unfortunately, it also sounds like a great way to have one less person who is actually willing to take responsibility on the staff.

    I think we probably agree on the solution to the problem. I just don’t agree that the entire teaching profession are liberals that can’t handle the responsibility.

  44. @T.
    Yes of course, not all teachers are Pinkos 😉
    I was being theatrical. Part of my job as an ‘evil’ conservative 😉
    And I am fully aware that a man or woman with a family has to wonder, in an emergency, how is s/he going to survive so as to continue to be a parent, and pay the bills.

    My perspective is that all my sons are now adults and nobody is dependent upon me. So I have nothing to lose. And having had military police training, I think differently than most Americans. So my extreme views are a lot more about what is possible than what most people would be willing or able to do.
    I understand that.

    Perhaps I have unreasonable expectations.