How the Second Round of PermaEthos PDC Sales Will Go
Okay as stated we have a new plan and it is as fair as we can be. I made three promises to the first 1000 founders, they were…
- There will only be 1000, it is a hard ceiling and won’t be raised
- Founders get first consideration in all things we do
- The founders price of the PDC is deeply discounted and we won’t sell it at this price again
We cannot break any of those promises. From day one I built TSP on integrity, stating you may not like what I say but you can trust me to keep to what I say. I have never wavered in that for 6 years, frankly I never have in my life, I believe that is a big part of why PermaEthos is the success that it is.
Frankly as you read on, please consider this phrase I have stated many times in the last two days,
I would rather have one hundred people angry with me for keeping my word than have even one angry with me for breaking it, because the one would be right.
That is how I and the other owners of PermaEthos live, everyday, not just when it is easy.
With that we only have two choices,
- Open the PDC but not the founders program and charge more for it with less perks
- Don’t let anyone else in at all right now
In the end those are our only two choices and the only two that keep our word. Keeping your word isn’t always easy but I believe it to always be the right thing to do.
We went with item one, here is why. We know without a shadow of a doubt that we can take 1500 students, we absolutely know that. We know that only at best 60% of students will submit a design within 90 days of our publishing of the last module. Nick and I know we can handle evals at that level and we know we can handle the Q&A. So there is no reason not to let more people take the PDC.
We also know that there are more than 500 people that want to, so we are raising the price significantly. This is so that it WILL SELL SLOWER and those that really want in, get in. The folks that come in on the second round of sales will NOT BE FOUNDERS, they will simply be part of the first class.
Said students will also qualify for discounts on future courses and other qualified products. We never for one second locked ourselves into only founders getting discounts, but the members of the second round of sales are not going to get first consideration, along with founders. They will get priority over the general public if it ever comes down to it. If a spot for something ever exists though where a founder and a non founder who are both members of the first class are in competition for it, we give the nod to the founder.
I believe this is the BEST compromise we can make. Later this week I will tell you why this is basically moot point though and should never be a problem. Here is the program in a nut shell…
Founders
- Paid 300 for the course or 3×115 in payments
- Will get a “PermaEthos Founding Member Certificate” this is not the PDC Cert but a Separate Certificate for simply being a founder.
- Their PDC Certificate (if they submit a design) will read, “Founding Member – Class 001” or something to that effect.
- Will receive first consideration over all others in any situation where spots are limited.
- Are going to be receiving some really cool extras only for founders we have yet to announce.
- Will get discounts on all courses and qualifying products.
First Class Members who are Not Founders
- Will pay 500 dollars for the PDC, when we open it for the Second Class sometime in 2015, it will likely be 700 or more, so this is still a discount and a damn good one.
- Will have “Member of Class 001” or similar on their PDC Certificate IF they submit a design.
- Will qualify for discounts. We think this is fair, and frankly it is a lot less of a fricken administrative headache for us if we do it this way.
- Will get first crack at class seats etc. over the general public but not before founders
No solution makes all happy when many are involved but I am not trying to make all happy, I am trying to be fair with everyone. Also this isn’t “Jack’s Decision” it is the PermaEthos Board and Owners Decision.
The ownership of PermaEthos is open record it is as follows
- Jack 35%
- Joe 35%
- Nick 10%
- Charlie 10%
- Kevin 10%
You will note that technically Joe and I could out vote Nick, Charlie and Kevin or that say Joe and Nick and Charlie could out vote say Kevin and I. We don’t run that way though. As TRUE partners we decided that in all major decisions we would need an unanimous vote. And folks that is what happened.
Why this Course is Worth a Lot More Than 500 Dollars Even as a Non Founder
I need to say something here before I continue. I am about to compare the coming PermaEthos PDC with Geoff Lawton’s PDC because I feel it is the only thing that even comes close to competing with us. Nothing though should be seen as attacking Geoff, he is my greatest teacher and mentor, that said, we set out to do better and I think we are doing so.
So again understand the 500 dollar price is still a deep discount, our target when the course goes into the second class is 750 dollars. Consider that Geoff’s course was 997 and I got your guys a 100 dollar discount on it or 897 for those that got in last time. Call that 150 more than our final price.
Here is what the PermaEthos PDC has Over Geoff’s
- Our course is in the field showing practical applications, not white board and power point
- Our course will be more balanced for people in temperate climates, we won’t spend much time on “tropics”
- Our course is being filmed and produced by a 20 year veteran of Hollywood Video Production
- Our certification will include Josiah, Nick and Myself as your instructors. We may not be Geoff but we are all certified by Geoff
- The Q&A will have two perspectives (Nick and Mine) vs. the one of the instructor. This is really a big deal.
- Our PDC is the first step into a entire series of courses that are going to be tailored to student and market demand.
- To be blunt our PDC funds the development of PermaCulture Farms and communities, not just the producers incomes. I want to be clear that isn’t a jab at Geoff, but it is true. We are using the majority of funds to build farms and programs for graduates, not as income for ourselves. Of the 5 of us Joe is the only one with a salary from the company and it is a paltry living wage of 25K a year!
I am not saying we are better than Geoff, just that we have some real advantages, the Q&A being one of the biggest. Consider that when you ask an instructor to explain something, you are asking the same person who already explained it that you didn’t “get it” from the first time. Think about that.
When you ask a question here you are going to get an answer from me or Nick Ferguson or in some cases both. This means you get a different view into the same situation, a different explanation, this makes it easier to understand.
In short we were always going to sell this course in the future for somewhere above the 700 dollar price. We designed it to be worth at least 1500 and we think it is. Likely Nick and I will end up producing hours of supplemental content in addition to the Q&A segments. Those won’t be in Hollywood video level but they will be HD and easy to see and understand.
Frankly no one right now, at this time can compete with what we are doing, we are going low on the price because you have to wait over a month for block one of the course and we want to reward those that step out with us.
Launch of the Second Round
I don’t want any butt hurt whining about not enough notice, today is May 25 and I am telling you right now that launch day and time is going to be Saturday May 31 at 8AM central time. The course will be open for 500 dollars, for one week (until 8AM the following Saturday) or until it sells out. There will be 500 spots available this time.
The sign up page will be the same page it was last time, it is already in the MSB and in the Brink of Freedom Premium area, so you already know the time and the place.
We have decided this will be open ONLY to MSB and BOF Premium Members, we figure if a 5 dollar a month membership keeps you out, you don’t really want in anyway. If anyone finds that unfair, I say it would be unfair to those who supported Joe and I as we both built what we have not to hold the line on that.
The Decision Here is Final
There have been requests to open it wide up, keep the price the same or get this raise the price a DOLLAR to get by on a technicality. Man that isn’t what this group is about, we are not going to hide behind stupid crap like, “it depends what your definition of is is”.
On the wide open request we just can’t. 1500 is a class size Joe, Nick and I are comfortable committing too, we know we can serve such a class well. People have asked for a cheaper price where you only get the videos and not the certification, etc. All such requests were heard and considered, not getting a yes to what you ask for doesn’t mean you were not heard.
We listened to all, we considered both majority and minority opinions. In the end within our judgement and integrity we did what we felt is
- Best for the company
- Best for the founders
- Best for all students in the first class
- Best for the staff at the farm
- Best for the future of permaculture
I know many second guess what leaders must do all the time, but I say to anyone that thinks they can do better, please do so, we need as much success in Permaculture as we can get. I am very genuine when I say that! If anyone does do it better that would make me very happy.
As for us though we are doing things the best way we know how, with the hand we have been dealt. One thing you will always know is we will keep our word and that we will also balance that with a people care ethic of doing what is right within the reality of what is required. For those of you supporting us on this journey you have my eternal gratitude.
Perhaps a bit of scrupulosity is in play, but I admire your attempt to honour your commitments. Whiners, please seek consolation elsewhere.
What the hell does that mean, I have no psychological guilt disorder here.
Dude. No long distance psych diagnosis is implied. I merely was acknowledging that you’re trying very, very hard to adhere to your understanding of your obligations. Jack, I’m glad you feel honor-bound in this matter, and I’m delighted with the success of PE. I’m also thankful for another chance to take the PDC as it unfolds. Thank you for your past and ongoing efforts with TSP, MSB, and PE; while all of these projects are indelibly products of your personality, they all also bear proof of your having created projects that go far beyond yourself.
HEAR! HEAR!
Sounds reasonable, well thought out, and fair. You have my support for your decision as one of the 1000 founders…
Dr. Richard
Jack, You are indeed a Founder. Thanks for all your heart, passion, and sweat poured into this venture.
Sounds extremely fair for all parties involved! Even at $500, the class is a heck of a deal. And at the end of the day, integrity trumps making a few extra people happy.
Once again you make good sence. Thanks Jack for all you do. I’m proud to be a MSB Member and Founder.
A very fair answer. Well thought out and well explained.
Thanks,
Jesse
Perfectly reasonable . Good job Jack et all.
I agree. But I would like to mention that your ownership percentages of permaethos adds to 90%..am I counting wrong? Was this intentional?
I’m not worried about it, just curious
No it was a typo Joe and I hold 35% each, so it has been corrected. Thanks for the catch I have a lot on my mind right now.
No problem Jack.
I’m sorry to see the crap you’ve had to take for doing your best at doing the right thing. Seems like some of these people are looking for any possible excuse to be unhappy with you.
Sounds more than fair on all counts. It’s good to know more people will get to take the course, even at the higher price. It’s also good to know there will be more funding for the farm. It’s always good to have reserve funds, just in case.
Looking forward to everything that comes from this first epic PermaEthos domino =)
Keep it up everyone!
I love your plan but you are scaring the straights.
When I refer newbies to your website, they think you are selling something and I’m a shill. That of course is not the case but they don’t know that.
(Ok, yes I am a whore but not yours. HA! )
But newbies don’t understand, going in.
Jack, you know marketing. What are you trying to grow? Permaethos or TSP?
What’s your target audience? Those who can afford permaethos or increasing audience for TSP?
I think maybe you have gotten a little ahead of yourself, in that you are preaching to the choir and maybe forgot that to keep the seats full you have to bring new people in the front door???
Jack, someday you will advise Presidents but to get from here to there requires focus. You can’t occupy all points on the map, somewhere the is an arrow saying “you are here” and you want to go….where?
Figure out where that ‘where’ is and that’s your marketing plan.
@Cryptozoic, I have no time for your crap about this yet again! PermaEthos has represented less than three percent of the content on TSP in the last 6 months. I am not interested in your BITCHING as you were told yesterday there is a welcome center for new people and your bitching has me considering adding a tab called “The Door”.
Oh for God sakes a website selling something the fricken horror!
Why don’t you let me worry about what people think when they come to my site and if you want to introduce a new person send them to an episode you see as a good fit or don’t send them at all. The choice is yours but I will remove any further OFF TOPIC bitching in this or similar threads.
And I will never advise presidents, I see no solutions in Government. If you mean corporate presidents, I have already been in that role, it bored me.
Here’s a nutty idea: if the people you’re referring to the website are so horrifically appalled at the sight of Jack talking about a new project of his that people have a chance to buy into, maybe wait a week or two for everything to settle down and the PermaEthos stuff to get knocked off the front page.
Or, ANOTHER crazy idea, maybe only refer people mature enough to see the PermaEthos posts and not fly into a blind, spittle-flecked fury over a man having the gall about offering something of value to his longtime audience.
Seems a very well reasoned and fair decision, but more importantly, an honorable decision. I was for opening more seats at the $300 dollar level, but I’m happy with this outcome as well.
As a founder, I’m excited to be a part of a movement that will truly promote self-sustaining LIBERTY using free-market principles and sound scientific design strategies.
Let’s Grow Places!
Here! Here!
Couldn’t have said any better than May214 did!
Yep, same here. It wouldn’t have upset me at all if you’d reopened the Founders program at the same price and everything. But I get your point. I really do hope this makes more people happy or content than it makes angry. Vitriol won’t destroy this movement, but it really does make things unpleasant.
Jack, just put it to bed. Turn off you computer and enjoy the weekend. We will still be around….. Looking forward to the next great podcast. 😀
Best advice I’ve seen on any topic in a long time 🙂
I second the motion. Jack, take the rest of the weekend off and enjoy your success.
Having many years ago subscribed to the oath “We will not lie, steal, or cheat, nor tolerate among us anyone who does,” I find your decision to be spot on. It’s great to be a part of a community with this character of leadership. Well done!
First @Cryptozoic please find place to fix whatever personal problem you have and quit venting here. Seriously man, I saw yesterday and today that your manufactured problem was solved in three ways, individual episodes, the welcome center or not letting the door hit you in the ass, please pick one.
Next let me say I am not a founder and I am not taking a PDC. I like the basics of permaculture and I even like to hear Jack discuss it and growing stuff in my yard but I am just not into it the way some are. I still want to see Ethos succeed and hope to visit one of the farms some day or something like that, I’ll damn sure buy products when/if I can.
That said this open letter to the community above is one of the most incredible things I have ever read. I have never doubted Jack’s intentions, but I did doubt the ability for this to be as “open source” as he said it would.
I don’t think there is a CEO in American business that would bare the soul of his company the way it was just done above other than Jack himself. I may not be a PDC guy but I am MSB and have been for 4 years, I tell everyone INCLUDING NEW PEOPLE I know about TSP and I have never been prouder of that then today. Crypto, perhaps you should consider that!
Jack thank you sir for your service and I don’t mean in the military. To me even though I do thank troops and all, your 6 years of service to TSP trumps the shit out of your time in the Army, thank you sir also for your honesty and willingness to be open.
As a founder, I am more than satisfied with the decision of the board. Remember, PermaEthos is more than “just Jack,” although he is the frontman bearing the weight of the decisions being made.
I almost don’t even want to justify @Cryptozoic’s statement with a response. Alas, I am compelled to point out that he sounds like a “hater” that can be found speaking out at just about every other even remotely successful venture that delivers astounding value to all without charge and have built it to the point that the people who are paying for content do so voluntarily. As soon as something like TSP or PermaEthos takes off, people like @Cryptozoic seem to come out of the woodwork and whine without realizing the fact that these are commercial enterprises and are the livelihood of those that created them. If a newbie listening to the program can’t get past that – they truly aren’t ready for the message of TSP, and frankly, neither are you @Cryptozoic.
Founder here, this is a way fair deal. Thank you Jack. Long live permaethos!
Well Jack, in my humble opinion, you guys hit a home run in coming up with a solution to satisfy all (most?). The totally amazing response to the launch of Permaethos confirms for me that there is indeed a paradigm shift occurring here in the US in regards to food security. What an inspiration! I am proud to be a founding member and though this will be my third PDC, I am over the top excited about the course. FYI: My first 2 PDC’s cost $1000 each, not including travel and hotel expenses and being away from home one full weekend a month for 5 months in a row. Not to take anything away from those first 2, because I learned a lot, but this one is going to be soooooo much better!
Erin
aka Lighthorse
Hey Jack,
Founder here, I think this is definitely fair. I also had an idea that you might consider – offer seats that do not allow the submission of a design, and therefore do not have a route to a certification, perhaps at $50 less. If I understand correctly, people taking this option would not burden you, so you could theoretically sell thousands of these.
I probably will submit a design, but my primary reason for being a founder is to support PermaEthos, and to see the videos. I think there will be a tremendous amount of entertainment value in these videos, so I could see others just wanting to help you out and see the videos.
I refer you to the last segment. “The Decision Here is Final”
I think Eric meant allowing access to the content (without certification) as a long-term revenue stream rather than a butt-hurt bandaid for the launch.
Yep exactly – I was saying do what you are doing for another 500 seats, but then also offer an unlimited number of seats that are not eligible to submit a design to help raise some more funds and allow more people to view the material.
I see there are a lot of hostile people here that need to chill out, so I can totally get why you assumed I was another one of them. 🙂 I’m a huge TSP fan and can’t wait for the videos to start rolling in!
Please stop to read the last segment “The Decision Here Is Final” as Jack suggests.
He already addressed the issue and he made perfectly clear that there will be not be doing this.
He satated quite clearly in annocement..
“People asked for a cheaper price were you only get the videos and not the certification, ect, all such requests were heard and considered, not getting yes to what you asked for doesn’t mean you were not heard”
Its over..there is zero need to keep harping on about it.
The decision had been made.
Exactly and I and the other partners certainly selling just the videos cheaper would devalue the PDC. If you just want videos we will have something for you in the future but it won’t be a 72 hour PDC.
I have to agree with you 100% about not selling the entire set of videos at a discounted price. The people who are not willing to do more than watch videos are not going stick with it for the entire 72 hours. That’s longer than the entire original Star Trek series! A video-only product will probably do much better if it is much shorter.
I am not just speaking in the general sense, either. I got my PDC in 1998 and definitely do not have time to take another right now. I wouldn’t really be interested in an introductory video series, but I could see myself purchasing a video on a particular topic if I needed the information for something I was implementing.
I just came in off the fields after rotating two groups of sheep and a was so proud to read your post. I KNEW you would do the right thing! This was everything I was asking for yesterday….and maybe more. I have no idea why you fought me so hard. You kept your word…and in life, that’s all a man really has. Thanks for being a man a making the hard(er) choice to preserve the integrity of the founding members. After some of the other PDCs I have looked at and what this offers…$500 is still a screaming deal. I am looking forward to this and hope it will help me make a real impact on the farm. Thank you Jack. Seriously.
Because you voiced your opinion yesterday in a crappy, petty, screw everyone else way, that is why.
Not sure why it came across that way…not at all how I meant it. That why I hate texting and typing…I like to talk…stuff gets twisted. Anyway…thanks for staying true to your promises. That was really the one and only point I was trying to make. Guess we were on the same wavelength. Just not communicating clearly. I see that the more people we get through this PDC ( that do something with it)…the better off the world is. Enjoy the rest of your weekend and sorry I did not relay my thoughts better…all I ever wanted was exactly the direction you took.
Hi everyone!
What an incredible, exciting, LIFE inspiring opportunity this is for all of us!
Jack, you and the rest of the board all deserve a standing “O” for coming to the decision you did and for your application of it.
I pray y’all can all rest this weekend, turn the computers off and some music on and just relax and enjoy.
Your hard, hard work has brought JOY, expectation and challenge back into many lives and I personally thank you all!
Be blessed my friends!
Thank you so much for your COMMITMENTS and INTEGRITY!
I was wondering how y’all would resolve the issue and I must say, IMO your decision was fair and equitable to all involved. Like everything I’ve seen from TSP so far, the course will be worth twice or more than whatever you charge participants. What really makes it unique among all the others out there is the fact that proceeds from the course will also help to build a viable and economically sustainable agricultural model that will eventually enable many folks across this country to earn a viable living providing safe and healthy products, ethically developed using Permaculture methods. And to me, that is truly priceless.
I’M A NEWBIE… to both permaculture and TSP. My MSB membership was a gift from a friend, and I’m excited as H-E-double hockey sticks at the opportunity to get in at just the right time to get this worthwhile venture off the ground with a running start. Food freedom is liberty, individual security, and if SHTF… Survival.
Teaching and enabling others has been part of Jack’s mission all along…. Even though I’ve only been listening about 2 months, I’ve gone back and started listening from episode 1 from the mobile studio on my own 50 mile commute… those episodes average about half the length of the current episodes, and I’m almost up to 2009.
At $500 the PDC is still a great value, and I’m sure we won’t be let down … now, if only I can scrape up another $100 before the weekend. Know any good beaches that are paying-out this time of year, Jack?
2 questions: does the price include taxes? Will there still be a three payment plan?
That’s cool. I actually had planned to sign up with the founders class, and was even around when the course opened, but thought to myself, Bah! There will be plenty of time to sign up. This won’t sell out right away.” Hahaha! Well, he who hesitates is lost, and when I went to the site to sign up and saw the Sold Out notice, I thought, “Day-um! That bastard did sell it out. Shame on me.”
But I was obviously happy to see it being opened up again, albeit at a higher price and without the Founder benefits (and rightly so). So I guess I’ll be hanging around again on May 31 at 8 am central. Thanks, Jack, for taking into consideration all the people that wanted to get in and couldn’t in time, as well as imbeciles like me who thought we had all the time in the world.
Cheers,
Rich
The last 48 hours must have been pretty trying for you, Jack, but this sure sounds like a fair and equitable solution to a sticky problem.
Congratulations again on a hugely successful launch. This makes me even more excited than before about the day I’ll be able to hang up my corporate hat and pursue a more balanced and self-reliant lifestyle.
Yeah no kidding – I feel really bad for Jack that this should be an incredibly joyous time to see this amazing success, and it seems like a very small group is trying their best to ruin it for him.
Hi Jack,
That’s as fair and equitable solution as any. I didn’t make it into the first round, though I wanted to. But, you can be sure that I’ll be online early Saturday morning to get on on this.
Out of curiosity, the first round had an option of a payment plan. Will the second round also have that as an option?
Thanks for all your hard work.
Haters want to hate Jack. Let it go and enjoy the rest of the Memorial Day weekend. This is a very happy time for both TSP and PermaEthos.
Good job Jack and Friends.
As a fortunate founder, I’m very pleased to hear that you and the team have decided to allow more people to join the PE movement. Thank you for turning me on to Geoff Lawton (I’ll be finishing up his PDC this summer) and for opening yet more opportunity for me (and many others) to pursue a permaculture way of life.
I agree Jack you did what you could for this situation.
I Am a Founder who will do the class, but may take me a little bit longer than the average person.
This should be an interesting Journey We All will be on so lets have some fun doing it.
For now Jack take it easy and open up some adult beverages and relax.
founder #770 here ( wanted a low #, that was at the 52 min mark, messed up mountain time to eastern time, so I thought I was 8 min before launch time) good call, jack. proud to be a founder!
My wife and I talked about what we thought would be fair to all parties yesterday. Neither of us can think of a better solution. We both agree that if we had missed out on being founders we would still be thrilled to take this PDC at 500. You guys did a good job. No one should say different.
As one who wanted very much to sign up, and missed it, I have only myself to blame. I KNEW when it opened, and made the assumption that I’d have plenty of time. Thanks, Jack, for making a way for me to sign up despite my stupid assumptions! I don’t care about a certificate, I simply want to learn all I can about all this, and I certainly don’t want to wait until the next round, regardless of the cost. We are moving to our homestead in the next couple of weeks, and I will need this knowledge long before the next round of PDC courses is offered. Again, thanks!
Congrats on the new property Mike!
You are going to have fun with it.
As a founding member I consider myself very lucky. I live a couple hours north of Elisha’s Springs. At launch time, I was on the road traveling south.
It took me about 2 hours of trying on an iPad before I finally got the order to go through, but if it hadn’t worked, I was stoping at Elisha Springs and handing Josiah a check for the PDC.
Needless to say, I was determined.
That being said, Jack, I want you and the rest of the board to know I 100% support your decision on the second launch and can find no flaw in it.
…And Jack, your time and energy are much too valuable to the rest of us for it to be wasted on haters and corporate trolls.
I’m good with this and appreciate your efforts to come up with a good solution. I think you guys did right by sticking to the 1000 founders…. I’m sure I’m biased but if seems right. #628. 🙂
Sounds great to me Jack. I wish all things in life were this well thought out and this fair! Rock On Brother!
As expected, Jack and the team came up with a great solution under challenging circumstances. Great job and can’t wait for the course to begin! #83
All I have to say is, Permaethos leadership ROCKS! I am more excited to be a part of this than I was when I opened my first business. Keep up the good work.
Love It! Thanks for the opportunity Jack. Tell Dorothy the Aloe Vera plant she gave me at the workshop has grown into friggin giant. I hope to see you all soon.
Best,
R
Jack – relax – have a homebrew – you’ve earned it.
I’m looking forward to PE setting the permaculture world on fire (in a good way).
Like
Thanks for the thorough explanation of the situation. Guess the “Double Oh Ones” will need to work that much harder to make Founder vs. 001 decisions that much tougher! Disclosure: I am NOT a founder so this applies to me.
As I said the issue is all but moot anyway. About the ONLY way this would ever come up is if we had two virtually equal farms, the people owning them had the budgets for their development and the on site resources and they were virtually tied. Then one would have to be a founder and the other in the first class but not a founder. Odds ———————— Long. % of people that will complain that will NEVER be even close to this situation, most.
The other I guess could be two people competing to be element partners on the same PE farm, at the same time for the same niche and both fully and wholly qualified. Odds ———————— Long. % of people that will complain that will NEVER be even close to this situation, most.
The most interest will be in future courses like the Bees, the Nursery course and remote element partnerships. We would not have a conflict even with a 100% pull though of Class 001. 1500 divided by 50 states is an agrigrite average of 30 a state, if you double it it still doesn’t matter. On Cooper Street in Arlington where I used to live there are 6 big box nurseries that do business hand over fist on a single one mile stretch. So I think the entire state has room for 30-60 small timers spread out. We need as many bee keepers as we can find and while honey sells in stores pretty well, finding good back yard NON SHIPPED TO THE ORCHARD OR COTTON FIELD honey is hard.
As a beekeeper, it’s not hard in Kansas to find non shipped honey. It’s in every grocery store right along with the commercially packaged. Beekeepers, as a rule, just do a poor job of marketing IMO. I know a sideliner who has 55 gallon drums full of honey, all treatment free and non-heated on certified apiaries. He can’t sell it, rather he is unable to sell it, because he’s not good at marketing.
Well this is why HOW TO SELL will be as big a part of what we teach as how to create in all our element partner courses. Most people like this buddy or yours could sell the shit out of stuff if they just let 100 of their neighbors know they had it.
Jack, I’d like you to consider accepting bitcoin for this next round. Your reason for not doing so before was because you needed fiat currency to develop the business, but you have met all your projections, right? So how about accepting bitcoin?
Thanks.
The reason stands,
1. We have enough bookkeeping crap to deal with with a brand new business not to add another variable.
2. BTC is volatile and we promised to use the majority of funds for company operations/expansion.
I love bitcoin but it isn’t right for us at this time.
Now I gotta finish learning the way of the bee so I can bring ya’ll the wild honey from our hunting ranch in the Chihuahuan desert. Wonder when Michael Jordan is having the BeeDC?
That sounds like a great plan Jack. I will be setting the alarm clock to a little before 6:00 my time Saturday. I didn’t think it would sell out so fast and procrastinated, I’m not going to let that happen again.
I’m just an IT guy with a little land but I think the PDC will pay for itself over and over.
Thanks Jack. This is the best solution that you have just proposed. Hope to get in this coming $500 round. Am so inspired by this project and your unassailable integrity-honesty-generosity. May PermaEthos positively transform many hearts-minds and soil. Buddha bless.
Jack,
You nailed it, brother. Good job on the decision to you and the team. Bravo Zulu to all.
We all knew the deal. You made it very clear. And there is not anyone here who should complain. You have 90,000 downloads a day. (I know those are not all MSB members). Josiah has a community at BOF. I don’t have to be a friggin math wizard to realize that 90,000 people does not go into 1000 very well. I was refreshing the screen of my iPhone at work from 11:55 till it opened. I wasn’t taking any chances.
I own two retail stores and am looking for a PermaEthos partnered nursery to get me out of that family rat race business after 32 years. How serious should I have treated a 1000 founder sign up? Shame on me if I played around with this.
Enjoy the rest of the weekend, Jack. I agree with your decision.
Alex
I agree that this is a good solution.
“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”
Margaret Mead, American anthropologist and author
$500 is a little too steep for me Jack. I’m sure I could have talked my husband into spending $400. What a shame. I’m sure you’ll have plenty of other takers though.
I am very happy with this decision. I feel disappointed that this time of celebration should have been marred by controversy and division. I’ll give my vote of confidence to jack and the whole PE crew, for whatever it is worth.
Happy with the decision Jack.
I was one who suggested opening it back up at the same price but only to as many as you could handle. That being said all of us who signed up are happy with your decision to honor your promises. Those who aren’t happy…well I was lucky I was able to use my phone at work. If I had missed out I still would be happy to be able to purchase it at 500 or even the later price of 700. If jack and Josiah don’t charge more this will never be funded like it needs to be and in the end if you want to learn permaculture design, 700 is still a great deal for the value you will get and be able to install n your life from 2014-……… Perma ethos is not a charity that is focused on providing pdc’s at the lowest cost possible so they can run on a shoestring budget with 1 farm!
The value you will bring to your life and the example to share in your community is worth much more than a mid priced television.
Well done jack and we are all very excited to start this new chapter that the pdc will offer us
Great job Jack!
Hey Jack, et. al
The fates being what they are, decided right as I logged into TSP to get my PE entry in, that now was the appropriate time to shut down the block with internet access. I even ran down the street to try my neighbors, but alas, no go.
I was very upset to see that 1000 had already signed up by the time I was back on net, but understand; you made decisions and are sticking with promises.
When I read THIS post, I certainly see the integrity involved. I hope that I can get to be one of the additional 500, and its still a bargain on a quality PDC.
To all the founders, congratulations on getting in there, to the additional 500, I hope I can get in there with you, NJ needs some form of change while Im still here.
By the way, if anyone want to sell there founding members entry(as postulated yesterday) I think your frigging nuts, but I would gladly purchase it, since its not just a PDC that you have purchased, but the vision that is PermaEthos. Wasn’t that the reason you rushed at the purchase within 3 hours after all?!?
Pharr
ROGER.
Hope I get in this time. I admire the way you handled all the quibbling.
Ha, Kevin are you the guy that sent me the email about quibbling? If so it gave me a good laugh, if not it is just sync. It isn’t a word we use much any more but it sure as hell should be for how much it is done.
Yes, that was me. That definition always made me chuckle, and If anyone listens to a lot of quibbling it’s got to be you. Really glad you liked it. Heartfelt congrats on all the success.
I’m pleased to have got on the PE PDC. I don’t usually leave comments on websites and forums. I just wanted to congratulate Jack on selling the PDC 1000 places so Quickly. I’m also happy for you to have opened up another 500 places for those who missed out the first time. Looking forward to beginning the PDC .
Thank you Jack.
Thank you Jack for such a wonderful opportunity! I am very excited to be a founding member! My husband and I have been followers of yours for many years. You were the one who introduced us to permaculture. My husband was able to get into Geoff Lawtons online class but it was to expensive for both of us to take it. I was excited when you first mentioned what you were doing and knew that I had to be a part of it. I am glad you have stayed true to your founding members while still allowing others to support your mission. My husband and I are already in the process of showing how much can be done on 1.75 acres in the Betkshires, MA. We are converting our 40′ barn into a permaculture and homesteading education facility. We are excited to be a part of the change!
Totally happy with the decision Jack.
My prediction….. Even at $500, this will sell out fast.
Well done!
Jack, you have my support.
Founding member here. I think the plan is perfect – I’m glad this was handled well. Looking forward to the PDC.
Since I assume you’re streaming on vimeo, would you be willing to open up viewers only slots after the 500 dollar level? I don’t need a cert, as I already have Geoff Lawtons, but I wouldn’t mind watching. Could it be incremental income with no cost to you?
This was already answered several times. I’ll use Daniel Boone’s answer verbatim:
Please stop to read the last segment “The Decision Here Is Final” as Jack suggests.
He already addressed the issue and he made perfectly clear that there will be not be doing this.
He satated quite clearly in annocement..
“People asked for a cheaper price were you only get the videos and not the certification, ect, all such requests were heard and considered, not getting yes to what you asked for doesn’t mean you were not heard”
Its over..there is zero need to keep harping on about it.
The decision had been made.
I guess I missed that, but you don’t have to be so rude about it. I have not been the one “harping” this whole time.
Sorry didn’t mean to be rude. I just copied and pasted Daniel Boone’s response.
She only seems rude because of how many times this question has been answered.
No worries. Just hopefully there will be a way to throw some money at permaethos in the future. Hopefully a grafting/propagation course 🙂
Great solution, Jack! I’m a new listener / MSB member this year, and I am SO excited to be founder #387! I think this is a great solution for the demand.
I can’t wait to dig in to the course and you can BET on my design submission at the end. For years I’ve been turning the idea of a community farm just like you’re going to build, over and over in my head, with NO idea how to make it happen. Someday, maybe I can get on one of those lists, provide the capitol to buy a nice piece of land, and I can be a PermaEthos partner. A girl can dream!
Jack, I knew you guys would come up with the best, fairest solution you could find., and I think this is great. I appreciate your input from the founders, even when we each individually have a miniscule investment in the venture compared with you guys on the board. It is a privilege to participate, and your concern about making things transparent and fair is one resason I had NO DOUBT it would sell out fast. Really excited to learn in the PDC and see where PermaEthos goes. Thanks for all your hard work, and to Dorothy for ‘giving ‘ you and so much of your energy to the community at large.
Love seeing people coming together. I was lucky to get in as a founder, but completly support what you and the team decided Jack. Wish you wouldn’t have to go through all these hard decisions amidst this exciting time.
This question may have already been answered and if so I apologize for missing it.
If someone takes the PDC as part of the next 500, completes the PDC, the starts producing output they can market. Could they (providing they follow all PE guidelines and approvals) use the PE branding as mentioned in a few podcasts? Or would they have to be a founder?
I support the decision either way as well as PE, TSP and the good fight! Just wanted to make sure I understood the branding piece long term of PE and being a part of the brand as a PDC participant but non founder. Thanks for all you do! Hope to make the next batch!
No, because no one can with just taking the PDC. You are talking about individual product sets and those will have individual certification requirements. That said, yes a person who takes our PDC will qualify for those courses and programs but so will anyone with any recognized PDC. But of course members of class 001 will get discounts on all such future classes.
How does an MSB member sign up for the PDC tomorrow?
Will you send us an email with a link to buy the PDC?
Or do we have to sign in to our MSB membership and then
click on a link? I haven’t found that link yet. Maybe it will
be posted on my MSB login page tomorrow.
I don’t want to be sold out this time.
Thanks
The link is in the MSB as it says in the post above, yes the link is in the msb, it is BOLD RED at the top of the main page when you log in, I can’t imagine how anyone can’t find it,
Jack
I think I found the link!
I’m waiting for it to become active at 8am.
I know how People are missing it Jack. I call it the deadly snake situation. We all have looked at something but did not see it. If it had been a deadly snake we all would be dead. We all hope this never happens with a real life deadly snake.