Episode-364- Follow Up on the 22 vs. the Shotgun
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Today’s show is a follow up on Episode 360 so the show notes and links will be quite brief. We are going to discuss your comments, objections and thoughts on the 22 vs. the Shotgun for survival needs.
Join me today as we discuss…
- Why even debate a one gun solution
- What about the 22 Hornet
- What about the 44 Magnum
- What about the 22 Magnum
- What limitations do certain actions have
- What can we do to reduce noise beyond even the 22 low report
- What about break down weapons like the AR7
- And more!
Resources for today’s show…
- Members Support Brigade
- TSP Gear Shop
- Join Our Forum
- Sawtooth Tactical – (sponsor of the day)
- The Survival Seed Bank – (sponsor of the day)
- Mastering the 22 Rifle (my eBook due out in about 3 weeks)
- The Super Colibri
- Ron Hood’s Survival.com Magazine
Remember to comment, chime in and tell us your thoughts, this podcast is one man’s opinion, not a lecture or sermon. Also please enter our listener appreciation contest and help spread the word about our show. Also remember you can call in your questions and comments to 866-65-THINK and you might hear yourself on the air.
I bought my 13 year old a Rossi trifecta at a local sporting goods store for $179. It is a youth model single shot break barrel that has three barrels, a .22, .243, and 20 gauge shotgun. The .22 is no tack driver, the .243 groups are nothing to brag about and the 20 gauge single shot kicks like a mule BUT… it all packs up into a small bag that comes with it, and it gives you everything with minimal compromise. The .22 is perfect for small game, the .243 is acceptable for deer and stationary game that falls between a squirrel and a bear, and a single shot 20 gauge with a modified choke is very versitile. It’s youth sized, but I have no problem shooting it. If nothing else I am going to pick up another one to toss behind the seat of my truck just because (1) there’s nothing more handy than a single shot .22 and I can leave it in that configuration ready to go in a very small space (2) I don’t own another .243 or 20 gauge, but I have a .270, a 30.06 and several 12 gauges. If I run across .243 or 20 gauge ammo and have no gun… just sayin!
Right now my medium go bag has four guns… a .22 beretta minx, a folding stock 10/22, a ruger .45, and a Remington 877 12 gauge (shoots ANY 12 gauge shell). If I have time and room I’ll add a .270 model 700 and next would come a ruger 9mm. Ammo for all of course. The ammo I stock the most is .22lr followed closely by .22 short (I have other .22 rifles and pistols that will chamber the short, and it’s QUIET for those situations where one well placed round in a semi urban area are necessary), followed by 12 gauge game rounds.. followed by .45 etc…
But if I was headed out in a hurry I’d be pretty happy if all I could grab was one of those Rossi trifectas, 500 .22 shells, couple of boxes of 20 gauge game shells and 5-10 rounds of 20 gauge slugs. For the size/weight/versatility it’s tough to beat.
I’m guessing my son will own his until he hands it down, and that’s one of the things that makes gun ownership special to me.
Just proofed my post (You should allow edits!) and I said Remington 877 when it should be 887.
“You know what I’m going to do just for those people? I’m going to say CLIP when I mean MAGAZINE.”
LOL! Do that on one of your YouTube videos if you really want to see the mouth-breathing Call-of-Duty-playing wannabes freak out in the comments section! 😀
Good show lots of good info.Ive heard of people shooting deer with a 22 hornet doesnt make a big mess but still does the trick.
I taken quite a few guns hunting including the rifle/shotgun combos you spoke of in the podcast, both 30-30/20 which is good for bear/grouse hunting and 22/20 for small game and birds. However, these guns are heavy. If I were to pick a single gun for hunting where the laws don’t apply, I would pick my ruger 10-22 w/scope. If all you care about is food, you can shoot birds while they’re on the ground, sporting be damned.
Is there any reason that a .223 rifle and some creative reloads couldn’t be used in place of a 22 Hornet &/or a 22LR? Could the rifle twist in a .223 hunting rifle work with lighter loads for squirrel and rabbit? I would like to be able to use the same brass & tools to feed my ARs and my critter-getters. If I hadn’t already bought three AR-15s out of fear & hysteria before the AW ban I might just plunk down for a 22H. But I’m now older, wiser & cheaper and I am looking for versatility & economy in my future purchase.
Regarding survival guns, my only concern is getting what I shoot at without fail. I’ve needed to hunt to eat in a few situations that I managed to create for myself. What I choose to take is a single shot shotgun usually loaded with #4 shot. I’ve a dozen other long guns from 22 to 22 Hornet to 25-06,308, 30-06 on through to 7 mag.
It’s just too easy to miss with a rifle, even if you’re a good shot, as I am. Miss a head shot on a grouse or a moving bunny and it’ more than a disappointment, it’s going hungry. My 12 ga will always drop any game under 100 ft. I’ve even killed a large coyote damaged sheep with the #4 shot at that distance.
The weight of shot is some concern, assuming you’re a refuge (moving and homeless) but just how many shots do you think you’ll get in any given period? Take a deer or cow and it’s one shot for a week. Long term survival, as in an end of the world situation, game will be scarce, probably too scarce to live on anyway after a few weeks. A 22, as much as I like and use them isn’t big enough to overwhelm with one shot. Forget follow up shots. If you can’t anchor an animal with the first shot, follow up shots on running game in cover is a waste of ammo. Wing shooting in a survival situation is a desperate act. not going to happen to anyone who lives long enough to be a survivor. Ground sluice em instead.
As for using a single shot, I’ve found the single is easy to get into action without fumbling with a safety and the lack of action means a light short reliable gun that you’ll have with you when you need it. Any second shot would be at running or flying game and I’d pass it up. Killing is what you want, not sporting around.
Self defense is a given with a 12 ga. Chances are you won’t be in long term repeat situations, just that first nasty one and nobody argues with a 12 ga more than once.
ps I’m listening to your podcast on quiet 22 shorts. They aren’t quiet enough in a quiet area. I’ve used 22 shorts to take out predatory birds eating “my” songbirds. The noise carries a long way. Too long. 22 pellet guns are the way to go in that scenario.
If the .22 shorts you used aren\’t quiet then you either used the wrong rounds or the wrong gun. At our local walmart there are two different types of .22 short available, both by CCI. One is a 29 grain CB short round nose with a listed muzzle velocity of 710fps. Those suckers in a .22 bolt action rifle are MUCH quieter in my backyard than my .177 break action air rifle! The primer only rounds (Calibri) are even quieter but are pretty weak and too expensive for my tastes. The other .22 short round that Wally world carries has a muzzle velocity of 1,045fps and is LOUD. Any of them are too loud in a pistol, but in the right rifle the slower CB\’s are darn near silent.
I agree with you on the choice of a 12 gauge over a .22 if I could only have ONE gun, but as was mentioned hopefully if I can only cary a 12 gauge in a survival situation my son/wife/friend will be with me carrying a .22. Breaking the premise a little, I can do a lot with a .22 pistol like a single six or a mark II semi, and they are small enough to pack along in almost any situation with a hundred rounds. While I wouldn\’t want to hunt small stuff with a 12 gauge, I can use an accurate .22 pistol for a lot of what I would use a .22 rifle for (stationary small game inside 50 yards). So a 12gauge and a .22 target pistol makes for a pretty good combo.
Finally got to listen to this episode (fell behind and now catching up). The part about 22 Hornet got me intrigues, so I started looking into the availability of rifles and ammo. And came across this article: How to Turn Your 22 Hornet Into a Part-Time Air Rifle (http://www.ehow.com/how_5123463_turn-hornet-parttime-air-rifle.html).
I too use an M6 scout as my go to 22 rifle. I absolutly love it! Its handy, compact and easy to carry and you can keep a certain amount of ammo in the stock. The M6 is a nice choice as a primary 22 if you can find it. Unfortunatly, Springfield Armory discontinued it.
My comments were deleted and edited by Jack. Why? Because I am a racist jackass and tried to use his blog to spread my message of hate.
Boy ain’t I an idiot!
A lot depends on location. I own 2 .270 rifles and a .357 levergun with matching revlolver. I have given the situation much thought and if I HAD to bug out the levergun would be my main defense arm. That being said nothing beats a single shot 12 or 20 ga for food gathering. I grew up with a single shot 20 and what a versatile gun. I am an avid grouse hunter and have taken them with a Ruger 10/22 and also a 20ga. The shotgun wins out every time. When I need to eat my single shot “boom stick” never lets me down. Tie one to the side of your pack.. A box of shells will go a long way.
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