Episode-816- Listener Feedback for 1-9-12 — 20 Comments

  1. Paul has a subject line covering Livestock Guardian Dogs at

  2. Pallet fence cheap to free fast to put up. (Last run for pallets we got about 75 feet of fencing for .05 cents per liner foot counting gas and a box of screws) Second to last run for pallets 50′ for .25 cents per foot. Link for you tube or search for pallet fence on you tube or with paul wheaton.
    We did a very small area and it worked for all pigs dogs and alpacas. It worked even on a hillside and held up in 40-60mph wind.

    Jack is correct on training your dog for invisible fencing. We got our little guy because he could not get home. With the noise and shock he still 4yrs later gets jumpy with beeping noises and heavy collars. We also have rescued 3 other dogs for the same reason but their homes were found and dogs returned. So training very very important.

  3. On your comment regarding Illinois bouncing checks. I don’t think the problem was Illinois did not have the $159k in the bank. The problem was likely a “positive pay file.” I have worked in IT for a long time, and whenever we issued checks, we sent a text file (nightly) to the bank which included a line for each check # and amount. This anti-fraud technique basically told the bank, only pay these exact amounts to exact check #’s, and return anything that does not match.

    I still agree with your premise that cities/states are going to continue to go bankrupt and default on bonds, just adding a little insight here as to what the problem likely was.

    Disclaimer: Not an Illinois resident, employee, or bond holder.

  4. Hey Jack, thanks for addressing my question.. I had been listening to a recorded seminar by Paul Wheaton on the chicken paddock topic, and right when it got to the part about using dogs to protect your livestock, his audio equipment failed! UGH!! That’s why I thought you might be able to help. I used to have cattle dogs many years ago who roamed my 40 acre farm with no issues, and they knew the boundaries of our property even without a fence. We’re a little closer together these days with our neighbors, and we also have more car traffic so I want to be sure to take care of my animals the best way I can. One thing we are considering is using welded fencing to make the front fence more secure, and also extending it down the property lines just far enough to secure the upper quarter of the land (where the house and barn sit.) I have a feeling the bigger issue will not be that our dogs get out and do harm, but rather the neighborhood dogs will come in to eat the chickens in the paddocks, meaning that my dogs will have to kick dog-butt, which will probably upset the neighbors. Not sure why I am limiting my own land use to keep someone else from being unhappy about their dog getting beat up.. totally stupid. Didn’t realize how stupid it was until I typed it!

    • Dene,

      I might suggest one of two other options in lieu of, or in addition to, a livestock guard dog. We raise our poultry (meat and eggs) in portable chicken tractors that are moved daily. You can also raise poultry using a portable electric netting with either hard (wired) or solar powered energizers from a company like Premier Fence Co. or Kencove Fence Co. Depending on what you are doing, geography, other predators (hawks for instance) will determine the best method. Dogs will protect against hawks if you use a poultry netting, but they then have to be in there with the birds.

      Using my current design for our meat birds, we have not lost one single chicken due to predation in the houses. They are dog proof after an incident a couple of years ago, in which I totally changed the design and went away from the Salatin style pen. And for the record, we took care of those dogs after the fact by practicing what we like to call the three S’s – shoot, shovel and shutup.

      I have not studied Wheaton at all, and I have no idea what his take on chickens are. He probably has some great ideas. I would like to say that this is my occupation and we raised 3,000 birds this year without a predator loss using no dogs. Our paddock shift occurs every 24 hours as we manually move the pens which is pretty easy really. We basically follow Salatin’s methods for farming more or less.

      Best of luck to you!

      Darby Simpson

  5. Jack a reminder that people should not use invisible fencing with sighthound breeds (Saluki, Borzoi, Pharoah, Ibizan, Greyhound/Galgo/Slough and Whippet) as they can run so fast that the shock or signal may not hit until they are past the fence line. Obviously, I hope no one out there is using sighthounds in such a situation at any rate, that is not their breed biology.

  6. I liked this show a lot. Unfortunately, Jack, I feel like you paid short-shrift to the Pennsylvania ‘fracking’ story though. When it came to your deeper opinion / thoughts on hydraulic fracturing, you abruptly turned a corner and seized upon your usual predictable disdain for the whole global-warming / carbon-scam.

    Just out of curiosity, I would like to hear your larger and more extended opinion on fracking. Like you briefly said, I too believe it is much more dangerous than any of the global warming / carbon stuff, and to that end, I wish you would give the subject of hydraulic fracturing some more attention as a threat that we (may) face; and I’d like for you to spend some more time covering this subject (threat?).

    • @Rottenclam, you come across like a typical “rotten” AGW “rottenidiot”! First my view and the view of even the main stream AGW cultists is that fracking has nothing directly to do with AGW. The only possible link would be IF large amounts of methane being released to the atmosphere. I wasn’t even remotely considering AGW for a micro second during this segment. In fact I am on record just last week stating that “methane is more likely to cause global warming than CO2”. In fact IF fracking is putting lots of methane into the atmosphere I will concede it could effect global temps, the fact that CO2 doesn’t is not related to this fact.

      My point here was only that the state of PA (who I know for a fact to be absolutely malicious on environmental issue, as I am from a family of bootleg coal miners) cleared this issue. The company claims not only to not be the cause but that the “water is safe”. Hence we should “test the water to see if the claim is valid” and if not the CEO of the gas company should have to “drink a few gallons of water a day for a few weeks to prove it safe” if he wants to stand on that. I gave a fair view of the issue, if the reporting is accurate the company should be libable for damages, if it isn’t accurate prove it. Testing for contamination is pretty easy and cheap to do.

      You response to that proves clearly that followers of the AGW cult are exactly that cult members driven by faith and propaganda not facts or evidence. WTF more could you ask for from me, a soliloquy I guess on how how exhaling is destroying the planet? People like yourself damage the environmental movement more than the CEOs of Exxon, Monsanto and GE could ever pray for. Seriously in the words of Stewy Griffith, “do you even hear yourself talk”.

    • Whoa. Way to insult a pretty loyal listener for no good reason, Jack.

      I told you I liked the show. It was one particular section that I expressed my opinion about (and the opinion was that I wanted to hear more from you on a particular subject), and now all of a sudden you say I come across like an ‘idiot’??? And because you really felt like piling it on, now you’re conveying that I’m exactly what the CEOs of those pretty sketchy companies pray for???

      Hell, I agreed with you on all your points. All I asked was to hear more on a particular point. Geez.

      Man, do me a favor and read my comment out loud (in the most objective tone possible) to a family member or a close friend, and ask them if the guy who wrote this was trying to pick a fight. If they say, ‘yes’, then I’ll humbly retract any and all statements.

      I’ve listened to every show you’ve ever done (yes, every single show!) and you talk about a global warming scam pretty frequently. Thats ok. Its your show. But just because I came on here and asked to hear more about a comment that I thought you could have expounded upon more…you shouldnt treat me like I’m some kind of disease (I mean, its not like I came on here and said ‘Go Broncos’ or anything like that. I’d understand that those would be fighting words.).

      • I read your comment you were insulted because you went into AGW mode. If you don’t like it I don’t really care. Now if you said Go Broncs, I would be happy to say congrats on winning a really big game.

        • Yeah, that section of my comment may have sounded a bit curt / provocative. I can understand how that may have ticked you off. Now that I think about it, if I could go back and re-write it, I would.

          The internet does indeed have a way of creating its fair share of ‘misses’. If we were two guys talking at the bar, it would be much easier for all of these conversation points to be articulated.

          Thanks again for everything that you do, Jack.

          Tim Tebow

      • I went into “AGW mode”???

        I disagree.

        Jack, keep on keepin’ on. I like what you do and more often than not, I really like what you have to say. Peace.

        • If I misunderstood you when you said,

          “you abruptly turned a corner and seized upon your usual predictable disdain for the whole global-warming / carbon-scam.”

          I apologize but I can’t see any other way to read that. Text is the lowest form or comms so again if you didn’t mean it the way I took it I am sorry.

  7. Darby, Great job stopping what could have turned into a very bad situation. I am a Texas CHL(concealed handgun license) instructor and stress in every class for people to CARRY their firearms. It does know good to get a concealed handgun license and not carry. I’m going to share your story in my next class as an example of a “real life” scenario. Good luck and keep packing.
    Bill Robertson
    Big Texas Firearms Training
    Visit… Big Texas Firearms Training

    • Bill-

      Thanks for the compliment. If it wasn’t for this show, I would not have been carrying. And to Jack’s comment today, my sidearm is now like the old American Express commercial: Never leave home without it.


    • Darby,
      I am glad your story ended great, but it made me uneasy. You really told them you CCW instead of just showing them? In my CCW training here in Minnesota 3 very different classes in 10 years and once by Joel Rosenberg (the man that wrote the training book), we were taught to just pull the gun and keep repeating, “Don’t hurt me, leave me alone.” A clear display of self defence. We were traind to never use the words gun, shoot, kill, any thing that could sound like you are the bad guy if someone only hears part of what you said. 10 people see\hear it, and you get 13 different stories.

      You put you hand on the gun and threatening could be brandishing, AND worse look to police or civilian like you were sticking them up. I am not saying you are wrong and states vary in training and enforcement. What state are you in? To me, the story just seemed like a bad recipy for getting shot yourself, by the police.

      I have been CCW, but 90% open carrying for 10 years. Here we can even go as far as un-holstering a gun and walking with it pointed at the ground while walking o your car in a dark parking lot.

      Again, happy to hear it turned out good for you. I am just very curious what your training looks like.


      • -Poke

        I think that maybe I need to rehash a couple of points for you so that you will better understand the situation I was in. Hopefully that will help to answer your questions.

        I verbally made them aware that I was armed, while visibly displaying my sidearm with my hand on it in a defensive position where I was ready to draw, aim and discharge my firearm. In my opinion, to “just pull the gun” is very poor training and a very poor decision. To each his own, but if I feel the need to unholster my firearm, there is a 90%+ chance that this action will be followed by a loud “bang!”. That is a life altering decision and you can’t make it lightly. If you have your gun in hand and your adrenal glands open, you could accidentally discharge your firearm and kill someone. You should think about that.

        Also, I did not threaten them. I was not the aggressor here. My question for you is this: How is placing my hand on my gun and being at the ready “brandishing”? Brandishing is defined as “to shake or wave (as a weapon) menacingly”. I think if I were to unholster my weapon as your training suggests, that would potentially be brandishing. And then I run the risk of someone seeing me pointing a gun at a guy in/near a truck with his hands up while I’m pointing a gun at him. No thanks! I think this would have potentially gotten me shot by the cops and rightfully so. No offense, but I hope you didn’t pay very much for your training. I would encourage you to rethink your training and what position it would have put you into in this situation. You might consider additional training, and I say that with all humble sincerity.

        Now, had the guy walked at me quickly with a heinous look on his face there would not have been NO verbal warning, just me drawing and discharging my firearm if he didn’t cease his movement towards me. I will tell you that he was literally one step from being face down in the gravel with a GSW to his chest cavity. This is a big deal, and I gave him every opportunity to back down and I’m glad I did. What if this was an innocent misunderstanding? You have to assess and calculate every situation independently, and I believe I did that here. That being said, I should have stopped and called the police prior to engaging the subjects. Lesson learned.

        I am located in Indiana, and there is not any state required training. My training is various, but in short it is this: You don’t pull your gun unless you are going to use it or feel there is a very high likelihood of having to use it (like the story I referenced in my e-mail to Jack – that guy did the right thing). That only makes a bad situation worse. Given how slowly the two men were moving and the physical distance between us, I felt I had time to back them off by verbally telling them I had a permit and letting them see my hand on my gun. It wasn’t until he heard me say that I had a permit that he looked at my right hip and hand – and then both men backed off.

        Also, the state of Indiana allows you to use deadly force if you believe that your life OR the life of another citizen is in danger, regardless of where you are (i.e., not just in your home). Per Jack’s suggestion, I also carry pepper spray with my keys but did not feel that it would have handled the situation here. If only one guy would have been present I might have elected to pull it out and just spray the guy and ask questions later.

        I hope that this gives you a little better understanding of how things unfolded, what I did and answers your questions. If not, please feel free to fire away another question.


  8. Watched the movie Gasland on HBO about a week ago. The similarities between how the gas companies acted and how the CAFO hog farms we used to live by were stunning. The arrogance these people have when they know damn well they are destroying peoples homes and lives. “Oh no, we can’t do anything or it will interfere with out business. What are you some liberal whack job trying to take jobs away?”

    No, what I am is someone who is no longer going to lay down and take you pumping someones drinking water full of poison or have cesspools of pig shit wash down the river everytime it rains.

    You don’t get to make a living by destroying other people’s property.

    My father uses the perfect word describing what they do: Douchebaggery

  9. Re:shock collars – I’ve been a groomed and state certified grooming instructor, as well as having worked for two veterinarians. Most folks get lazy and careless with those collars. They must be very tight tomaintain proper contact and must be removed every single day to check the skin for burns, irritation and other skin damage. I’ve seen dogs with open neck wounds that are running with pus because the owner thought this was an easy way to deal with a problem.