Episode-1616- Listener Feedback for 8-3-15 — 53 Comments

  1. I know this sounds like a whiny, entitled, pain in the ass comment, but is there any way you could post timestamps for about when each topic is?

    • “I know this sounds like a whiny, entitled, pain in the ass comment”

      And that is all!

      A gal did this for a few months, she requested tips for the service no one gave her a penny that told me how valued this service would be despite numerous requests.

      • I never knew of this service and/or tip jar either. It makes no difference to me, as I listen to the entire show regardless, but there is a value to the service for when I share with non-listeners.

    • I never saw the tip jar, and I only remember a couple episodes where it was done.

      I didn’t think you’d agree with my preface so heartily…

    • Cecil seems to me to possibly be some kind of new push on the anti gun/anti hunting front which may also be an agenda 21 thing we are yet to see. If that is the case, then we will see more of the same or related

  2. Thanks for the great show Jack, I’m a 25 year old South African and because of your influence I’ve been able to begin moving my life in a more positive freedom minded direction.

    (Also Zimbabwe is right next to my country and 99% of us here didn’t know Cecil before bloggers began making a big deal out of it.)

  3. Weighing in on the guinea question. We have kept and raised them on our place in Texas. They were free range on 30+ acres of pasture and mixed mesquite and oak forest. Our purpose was to control bugs damaging our pastures, gardens and landscape areas. Here is what we learned:
    Bug control is a fact, we saw improvement over several years. We noticed the guinea would roam further out each year to get to the larger bug population. We needed to control locust/ grass hoppers. They did their job well, it does take a bit of time to get momentum. I did not know about the ticks, however, we had very little tick trouble on any of our animals.
    They are much easier on your gardens than chickens. They will cruise through the plants to eat bugs but leave plants undamaged.
    We started with 24 babies and raised them with baby chickens. They lived in the same brooder and were fed a turkey starter formula. The chickens were supposed to teach them to home in at night. Worked great, and never any fighting between them. The guinea taught the chickens to roost in our mesquite trees, they would walk up the trunks and nest throughout the branches. Spot lights will confuse them. We came home to find them milling around on the ground under the garage spot light. We took some portable work lights and turned them on facing the trees where they roosted and they all went right on up. Kind of silly but it worked.
    guinea are not good at raising babies, they nest in remote places and predators will kill them and rob the nest of eggs. We were very successful at raising new young by placing the guinea eggs under our broody chickens. The chickens would raise them up and protect them from predators. The young guinea soon realized that they were not chickens and would mingle into the flock of mature guineas. Of interest was how protective the broody hen would continue to be toward “her chicks”. she would chase after the chicks and when a hawk or other predator would come around the chicken would race to protect the babies. Guineas are notorious for “every bird for themselves”. They would scatter and leave the young birds to fend on their own.
    Our largest trouble with keeping guineas free range was the constant attrition to Great Owls at night. We also had trouble with racoons taking out a bird or two. They would move around to other trees if a raid happened too many nights in a row. We also had a good guard dog who would chase off predators at night if they came around. He would hear the guineas become agitated or even hear a hawk call out..the next thing he would be out the door and chasing them off leaping into the air after the hawks. So you might consider a flock protection dog. Ours was a Lab.
    I suggest you start with a large number of guinea fowl and continue to replenish the flock by hatching eggs with a chicken.
    They are a bit noisy, but can be quite entertaining. They also will alert you to snakes. They will surround snakes and kick up a big fuss. We had large numbers of copperheads, rattlers and cottonmouths and a few coral snakes about. I really liked the snake alarm factor!
    I found them to be easy to maintain, they required very little supplemental feed. They were much less messy than chickens and did not gather around the house and barn areas making poop messes like chickens can.
    We have moved to Idaho and no longer keep guinea fowl. We have a much smaller property and predators would be a very big concern as we sit right on the edge of BLM and a large coyote pack. Chickens work better for us now as we can house them at night.
    We found the guineas did best if left to free range and treat them like a semi domestic bird.
    Hope this helps you decide. We loved them and will have them again if and when the situation is good to keep them.
    We did not use them as a meat source either, however, I understand they are quite good eating.

    • I found this book when looking for info on guineas a while back. The author keeps them with chickens and put 2×4 on the top of the chicken yard fence so the guineas can fly in an out to free range. Might be worth a look. The autor has a message board and awnsers questions at the site below.

      Gardening with Guineas: A Step-By-Step Guide to Raising Guinea Fowl on a Small Scale

  4. My Power Pressure Cooker XL arrived today, woohoo! I can’t wait to get started pressure canning small quantities frequently in my no AC house.

    Currently, I live at 300′ elevation but will be moving to 2,900′ elevation in a few months. Now I know, because the manual says, not to use this for canning above 2,000′ but I also know that high acid food can be water bath canned.

    So if I convert a low acid food to high acid by adding lemon or vinegar, I wonder if it would be safe to use. If not, I guess I’ll just be using it for high acid foods 🙁

    I know you’re sick of talking about this pressure cooker/canner but I really trust your judgement.

    • I really perked up when Jack talked about the Power Pressure Cooker until the elevation bit. We’re a 6200′ – sigh. Back to my 1/2 ton All American (at least it seems that heavy after a day of canning).

      • I hear that. I have a 1/2 ton All American too… I’m sighing with you.

        But I also received my Excalibur dehydrator today so I’m going to the Farmers Market on Thursday to buy a bunch of veggies and I’m going to try my hand at sauerkraut too.

        Oh, and biltong 🙂 thanks, Jack, for the videos!

        • Yep and that is the one drawback unlike a stove top one you can’t just change your pet cock and increase pressure.

          That said for COOKING along this product is amazing, and like Steve said very low power draw due to the insulation. Further I absolutely would use it for acid canning even at higher elevations. I can a LOT more often now being able to push a button and walk away.

          This seems like a product waiting to happen to me, a lager capacity machine with adjustable pressure to handle elevation changes. Come on China!

    • Let me add on, most non acid recipes won’t be good to convert. Not unless you want to make something “pickled” we are talking a lot of vinegar here.

      So the right way to see it is simply if the recipe can be safely water bath canned I would be willing to use it above 2000 ft, which is ONLY my personal opinion the manufacture makes no claims about that.

  5. Hi Jack,

    I agreed with about 80% to 90% of your take on the Cecil story (and you do address a huge part of this whole thing, it is indeed a ‘story’ that the media bangs the drum for), but there are a few things that I’d like to point out and maybe even one or two points that I’d like to contest.

    1. I think it is a healthy thing if humans care for lions, elephants, rhinos, or other species that have extremely small populations yet continued to be hunted for sport and/or money (i.e. the price of ivory). Man is the dominant species on the planet right now (and has been for at least the last 400 years), and because we’re fairly evolved, I believe that we have the intellectual capacity to be good stewards for the flora and fauna. This does not mean that we DONT chop down trees or kill animals to eat meat, as much as it means we are evolved enough to strive for balance (lets plant trees to replace the ones we cut down, and lets try to go easy on the animals that have dwindling populations)

    2. The whole concept of Cecil as a ‘beloved’ animal is a little blown out of proportion, but my guess is that the ‘beloved’ description came along pretty quickly because he may have been considered the ‘old reliable’ lion to photograph in the park, or the lion that you could count on to be around for a photo if you visited the park. Certainly a stretch to call him ‘beloved’ because of those things, but I figure that is how they arrived at using the term of ‘beloved’ (not because he was some magical Disney animal that would never eat you). My point – You make a very good point on dismantling the ‘beloved’ adjective.

    3. I dont think that wanting to prevent these types of animals being killed (again, those with dwindling populations) is mutually exclusive to whether somebody cares about veterans or not. It is possible to care about both. You raise the issue of what is the ‘caring priority’ though, and I think that is an extremely important point. That was indeed the spirit of the discussion that recently I had with a neighbor who volunteers for a children’s charity when we talked about Cecil the lion. My neighbor said, “look – I dont really care. I have little humans right in front of me that tug at my heart way more than a lion in Africa”. It was a great point to which I could not disagree in the slightest, but I did mention that with 6+ Billion humans on the planet, perhaps we’re a bit out of balance in comparison to the lion population today. But hey, in looking out for ourselves, are we going to sacrifice humans for lions? I dont think so! But with the huge delta between the two populations, maybe it should give us pause to consider what we can do to not exacerbate their extinction while riding the wave to 7 billion!

    4. Lastly, I’m pro-hunter and pro-gun, but in 2015 I’ll admit to being very anti-big-game trophy hunting. Some of my heroes (Teddy Roosevelt, Ernest Hemingway, John Huston, etc) were big game trophy hunters, but it is a different time now with pretty crazy population imbalances (IMHO). Some radical animal activists might argue that the population imbalances may existed 100 years ago. Hmmmm….I dont really know about that. But knowing what you also know; namely, that hunters and fisherman are some of the most dedicated conservationists out there, I’d hope that some are coming around to the idea of saying, ‘look, maybe we oughta pause on the big-game trophy hunting for a generation or two until these species start to really come back strong’.

    So just some of my thoughts and opinions, some of which may stand in stark contrast to your own opinions. As an aside, I believe I’ve been respectful in my comments and shared my take on this subject with an open mind so in all sincerity I’d like ask something special of you if you choose to respond. In anticipation of your reply, please do not tell me that I am stupid or call me an idiot. That would be unfair. I’m a longtime listener and supporter. Just tell me that you disagree, or point out an additional opinion I should consider.

    Take care,

    • I am going to have to talk about trophy hunting too because it is SOOOOOOOOO fucking misunderstood.

      Deer Hunter, sees legal deer shoots it, uses deer or gives away meat if he just likes to hunt and feed others.

      Trophy Deer Hunter, sees legal deer does not shoot it, waits for bigger better deer, sometimes doesn’t ever get a deer in the waiting, when he does see deer he wants he shoots it, uses deer or gives away meat if he just likes to hunt and feed others.

      The only fucking difference is the trophy hunter PASSES UP SHOTS, I am so and I mean so fucking sick of people using the word trophy hunter with no fucking clue at all what it means.

      But but but, some lady, she killlled um, wah sob sniff, this poor giraffe and it wasn’t for anything but a trophy.

      Um BULL FUCKING SHIT! Like I said today the fact that the lion’s meat was left in the bush says something was wrong and the guides at minimum knew it. When you go hunt Africa every scrap is taken by the locals, the best job on the safari party is supposed to be the gun bearers but it is really the skinners, they get to take the belly fat!

      As for the giraffe killed by the mean lady, here is the real story and please stop using the term trophy hunter, like most you clearly don’t know what it means.

      Trophy hunting means taking older mature animals at the crest of their prime, meaning they are heading into rapid decline. In many ways it is the MOST ETHICAL form of hunting. Stop believing bullshit the term trophy hunting is now like assault rifle, the media has ruined the meaning and people spout it off with no fucking idea what they are talking about.

    • @Jack – thank you for explaining the term ‘trophy hunter’ a bit more. I needed to be educated on it. With that in mind, I’ll think through how I can re-articulate my 4th point in the future.

      • Thanks for understanding and FWIW none of the anger there was at you, I am just sick of it in general. Sick of the media perpetrating a lie, people eating it up as bullshit soup over and over and puking it back up with no thought what so ever.

    • I agree with you. I think that the Cecil thing is just one of those news stories that people get all in a tizzy about.

      Also, there was news that Cecil’s “brother” Jericho, was shot on Saturday. Jericho was a protector of the pride and now that both are gone, there is worry that the pride (cubs mainly) will be unprotected.

      And maybe I’m ignorant on this topic, but do people actually eat lion meat? Was it an important meat for indigenous African people?

      To me, the bottom line is that if some species were not protected, they’d be extinct. And I think like you said, there is something to be said about “chilling out” on that specific animal until its population rebounds. That’s basic survival instinct, not to kill everything you eat so that you don’t have any food sources left.

      Lastly, people went ape shit over the killing of this lion, but no one talks about the 40 some elephants killed a day for their ivory. I wonder why that’s not plastered all over the news?

      • Okay a few things,

        1. The African Lion is not an endangered species

        2. The most conservation dollars for lions are raised by hunting license and fees, more than any other source more than any three combined.

        3. Too bad about the other male, how’d he get shot? Perhaps he left the preserve. Odds are a new male will take the pride but yea he might kill some of the cubs, it is what lions do. Disney be damned.

        4. Yes people eat lion meat.

        5. On elephants do you know how many are legally cropped by government employees a year? Do you know how many Alan Savory himself killed before understanding the folly of doing it?

        • 1. Yes, you are right. Why did I think they were?

          2. I did know that about the conservation hunting. I guess my upset on the matter was because I was operating off the thought they were endangered.

          3. After some research, Jericho is alive. Why would I even think about trusting my local “news” station. Sorry for posting that before fact checking.

          5. The whole elephant thing, I don’t really care who is killing them, legally or illegally, just that they are being killed (to their probable extinction) and it’s not common knowledge like this whole Cecil thing is and people aren’t losing their shit over it. Yes, I knew that about Alan Savory. I know he feels deeply sorry for that. I can’t imagine having that burden on me.

          I’m a 27 year old female who grew up in the age of Disney. So, yea, I have the Disney sickness. I am working through it though.

        • Well we are making progress, that said the African Elephant is not endangered either. The number one reason they are killed now is due to conflict with humans and because governments think they cause environmental damage in too LARGE of a population. The truth is SOME populations are endangered like say a herd that lives in a place is threatened but they are NOT and endangered species. If they were cropping officers would not kill 10s of thousands of them.

          Ivory poaching still occurs not nearly the problem the TV says it is though. It is so hard to move, poachers are more out for easy to turn over bush meat or high dollar voodoo type medicinals today.

          Also consider ivory hunters did do a lot of damage but those were not “trophy hunters” they were for profit hunters.

          Let me put it this way, if only trophy hunters hunted the American bison today we would have far more than the 50 million that were almost exterminated by MEAT hunters.

  6. Is there a link to the vacuum caner? I did an amazon search and couldnt find anything.


    • Check out Jack’s Food Storage show notes from a couple of days ago. It’s a link near the bottom, pretty cool device.

      I’d buy one but I already have dry canning attachments for my vacuum sealer for wide & regular lids for my jars.

  7. Re wood chips
    I have used wood chips (uncomposted raw branch and tree trimmings from my local contractor to mulch every thing I do on my property including 200 newly grafted apple trees planted in 5 gallon pots with no negative effects.
    I dont get the paranoia with wood chips if you can get them for free (or near as) use them everywhere even in my greenhouse beds to reduce watering in summer
    Cheers Finster

  8. Jack, based on your comment about Tattle canning lids and the Vacucanner I assume you can not reuse regular Ball jar lids even though they were never boiled? Thanks.

    • Indeed you can, sometimes one goes bad but it is and either or and on or an off you know if one isn’t working.

  9. Jack I have to comment with a small disagreement, while I do agree that 99.75% of “gamey” meat is the result of improper handling, there are occasions of deer feeding on less than desirable browse and will take on a off-putting flavor, especially in cedar (juniper) or sage heavy areas, the few times I have encountered this, was in areas where the landowners were heavily grazing goats that compete directly with the deer for food sources, forcing them to basically a starvation diet. With the upswing in the meat goat market the last several years this has become more common. Now back to agreeing, you’ll be able to tell this as soon as you open the deer for field dressing, the worst I’ve ever encountered smelled like a cedar when we field dressed her, smelled like a cedar when we cooked her, and tasted like cedar (really strong cedar) when we attempted to eat her. Just wanted to point out that under the right conditions what an animal eats will affect the flavor of the meat.

  10. For Jack,

    In your definition/opinion what is “gamey” (if it exists)? What do you believe other people call gamey? (Just trying to get kind of a solid cross section)

    When I think of the term gamey, I have always heard of it from the perspective of texture and potentially toughness of the meat, rather than taste.

    • I think gamey is a made up word that does not exist at all. There is no such thing as gamey. Quail, Deer and say Turkey are all game, we shoot and eat them all, they have NO COMMON flavor good or bad. Turkey taste like turkey, quail like quail, deer like deer and frankly wild pig like pig.

      All four of those can have off flavors from bad diet, improper handling, shitty cooking, etc. That off flavor will be different in all 4 animals. It will be called “gamey” by almost all people. Though it will be different in all four. Hence it is a made up word to describe any off putting tastes.

      Sour is a flavor. Whether it is a lemon or sumac or sauerkraut one can identify the flavor of sour.

      Fishy is a flavor a bad catfish, a bad clam a bad shrimp all have a “fishy” smell and taste. If you put that taste into something else you’d still say that is fishy.

      Sweet is a flavor, bitter is a flavor, tart, etc, etc, etc.

      Gamey is a catch all phrase that is misused so much as to render the word useless. Gamey means mostly now, “there is an off flavor that I can’t identify so I will just call it gamey”.

      My issue is the term game itself here, implying that any of the off flavor has any connection to the fact that the meat is from game, which simply means not farmed, wild and healthy and huntable.

  11. Good info on dry canning! I wanted to add that I pull my Co2 tank off my kegerator and fill the bag / bucket with Co2 prior to sealing (bugs can’t live in Co2).

  12. Social Security Diability Insurance (SSDI) and federal Supplemental Security Income (SSI) benefits have work incentives that allow you to keep some benefits while working more. There is even the federal Ticket to Work program to assit people on these benefits find vocational rehab programs. However, in my experience only 1 in 1000 are interested. Most folks just want to know at what point their checks start decreasing or stop.

    I do agree that there should be more programs to help those who do want to get off assistance. The problem is it seems there are not that many people who want to get off. Kudos to the lady you discussed for fighting to do so.

    • The problem with those programs is keeping some still always means having less.

      Simple math, I am getting 1500 in benefits

      I gain an additional 400 in income

      I loose 800 in benefits

      I am 400 in the hole.

      Keep in mind it isn’t just SSI it is all of the combined support. Many times health insurance alone will wipe out a wage increase of even 40-50%.

      Again while I want all of this shut off I can’t make a logical argument for the person on assistance that says, well fuck, why should I. Why should I work harder for less when I am already scraping by?

    • Like I said, I agree that if we are going to have the programs we should have incentives to get off of them. My comments were directed at SSDI and SSI and not at the many other programs (foodstamps, state assistance such as TANF etc.) as I do not know how they work.

      And no, not all programs are set up where you get less. SSI for instance, your beneift goes down $1 for every $2 you earn over $65.

      Math- Benefit $700

      Go to work and earn $500. Take off the $65 and divide in 2 ($1 for every $2)

      $500-$65= $435. $435 / 2 = $217.50

      $700-217.50= $482.50 SSI benefit

      Total $500 wages + $482.50 SSI= $982.50 ($282.50 more plus keep Medicaid)

      However, like I said most people do not seem interested. And a good argument can be made that the incentives are too complicated and should be simplified (I would agree.) Most folks on SSDI or SSI get to keep their Medicare/Medicaid for a certain period of time or unless they pass much higher thresholds.

      Again, no argument with the gist of your commentary. Just pointing out that their are some benefits with work incentives and yet still very few people take advantage.

    • Well, you might also consider that people on disability, which is what SSDI is, unlike those just on unemployment or general assistance, it is because they realy CANT work. That is the definition. SSDI is a long term disabled program, a short term disability, like after an accident would be covered under a state short term disability program.

      Yes, I am disabled and on SSDI, and a few years back I looked into this whole program, and maybe some day I will be able to do it, but their help to work is for people who are no longer disabled, to help transition back into the working world. It is not for a disabled person to work just a few hours a week to improve their life. And, the reality is that a disabled person who can do a little today or this week, may then be laid up and doing n0thing for a few weeks, so not a good candidate for regular employment from someone else.

      So, to just blanket say, most are just not interested is realy disengenuous. Most would likely be REALY interested, especially as this program does incentivize keeping benefits while working, if they actualy could be healthy enough to work. It realy is a good program, someone who just got better does not have to worry about losing benefits if they were wrong and realy couldnt handle the work (yet, or ever), they get to try out both at once and see if they can do it. A program like this also would likely be realy good to help transition off of more general assistance.

      • And that is exactly what I am talking about one example anyway.

        You have a disabled person that can’t hold a job but say they can make 100 bucks a week with some little part time activity. They try and next thing they have benefits pulled. Now they have nothing. It is indeed an antlion trap.

        • Just FYI- A disabled person on SSDI has a 9 month trial work period where they can earn as much as they want and keep all benefits (could be a million a month, really.) To count as one of your months you have to earn over $780 (for 2015.) In other words, if you have part time job earning $100 a month you will not ever use up your 9 month trial work period and can continue to do that forever.

          After the 9 months, you can still work and keep your benefits as long as you don’t earn over the set Substantial Gainful Activity (SGA) limit for the year, currently $1090/month for 2015.

          So anyone on SSDI can work and earn up to $1089 per month for 2015 and never lose any benefits. Even if you go over the $1090 (after the 9 months) your benefits stop but you get to keep Medicare for several years(which you get after 24 months of being on benefits)

          There are other regulations for getting benefits started again after the trial work period.

          All the above only applies to SSDI. SSI has its own rules.

        • I wonder how many people on SSDI even know that. I have a sister in law I have tried to give work to. She can be nutty but she is honest. She has been unwilling to take the work for fear of losing benefits. I could easily keep what she does way under that number, in fact I could not afford to go over it anyway. We are talking 150 bucks a week to say 250 once in a while.

          I don’t believe for a minute she is lying when she says she THINKS it would cost her her benefits. She is actually working hard to go back to work now but is scared what will happen if it doesn’t work out. Far as I know she is on good old normal SSDI.

          Huh? Guess not all case workers have their shit together like you do Ron?

        • Oh, I had forgotten about. I did find an opportunity, for while, where I used to live, where I went to an organic farm with a large CSA program and helped fill the CSA boxes once a week, in exchange for a CSA box of food. I brought my dd with me most of the time, who also worked (she was maybe 10 at the time, homeschooled, usually got her own box, or just spelled me if I was having a super bad day, we ate ALOT of produce those months). And, this farm sent a letter to Social Security about how much I made (money equivalent that the CSA box cost in open market) so that I WAS part of one of their programs for a while. Being part of the working disabled program, in even that small way, meant that my medicare premium was waived for those months I worked. Even just a bit over 100/month savings on the premium, plus the food, is significant when you are not able to work.

          But, a few things, first off there are very, very few opportunities like this, and you need to know someone to find out and to get it, this stuff is NOT advertised. Second, I was lucky that the women overseeing this part of the farms operations took the time to write the letter documenting, most people these days do not seem to go out of their way. Third, although we likely would have done this just for the food, this was not good renumeration for the time put in, as a CSA box might be worth $25 and you might be working washing and packing for 3 hours (or more, you go until it is done). Fourth, the work was becoming too much for me and caused further pain and other health symptoms, so long term I likely couldnt have kept it up even if we hadnt moved away. Problem is if you dont go every week, they cant count on you and you get replaced, so then you go even if your symptoms are flairing that day and you shouldnt.

          But, this type of arrangement is I think better than food distributions for free that happen here by me now. I have helped a few times at these, and there are 2 sets, people that realy just the getting there and standing in line is more than they realy should be doing. And, then people that seem to get entitled to it being there, and while most of those even could not keep a steady job, could actually help with gathering, unloading, filling bags or something. And, I know that if they did so, it would be better for all concerned.

        • @mountainmoma- just to clarify, for others reading- SSA and Medicare do not waive Medicare premiums. She probably wrote a letter to the state. Most states (all of them as far as I know) have programs with their own qualifications where they will cover part or all of your Medicare premiums if you qualify. Sounds like you were able to qualify for your state’s program. This is usually part of the state’s Medicaid program (which of course gets part of its funding from federal dollars.)

          It is very hard to keep up with. As I stated earlier, there is a very good case that the incentives could be simplified!!!

        • Ah, I am sure you are correct that it would have been a STATE program then. I dont know — I have cognitive problems when things get too complicated 🙂

          Another point I had tho, is that I agree with Jack in that we are all better off to have less entitlement and more being involved, in any ways one can, in meeting your own needs. So, having people that are able bodied especially, well I live in an agricultural region. There should be some way they could help with food procurement to get a food benefit, it is HARD work, even the washing packing, but it is good to keep a bot of perspective on the gifts your receive.

          Right now, I sporadically garden and give thanks to what I receive there

    • You are right that both of these programs in particular are long term disability programs. However, the federal disability requirements only require a disability that is expected to last at least a year (or in the case of SSI, be disabled or be over the age of 65.) Many people have conditions that improve after that threshold.

      If you are permanently disabled and can not work, then that is what the program is there for!

      However, I work with people on these beneifts daily and have done so for the past 13 years. I can tell you from personal experience that most folks that I deal with on these benefits do not want to hear anything about work incentives once on the program.

      Is that everyone? NO!!! There are some that genuinely want to go back to work and will take the time to find out the information needed to do so and transition back to full time employment. But my own personal experience for the past 13 years is that the majority of beneficiaries are not interested in incentives or returning to work.

      My comments were only meant to state that there are programs with incentives to get off but most folks (and I will stick by that) do not take advantage even if they are able. If the state programs and other assistance were designed with incentives, some would take advantage (like the lady Jack mentioned) and I think we should have those so that those who want to can get back to work. But thinking that if we designed them that way that a majority of those on would suddenly jump up and happily go back to work is not based in reality. That probably says something more about our current culture than anything else.

      Now maybe if they had to show up and put in a day’s work for their food stamp card as Jack mentioned, their would be an incentive to go out and find something better.

      • I think we agree about that, again I want it all gone but I would prefer not to see just incentives but NO OTHER CHOICE. Well of course I would actually prefer that it just go away but the way it is now is indeed a trap, it is how it was designed. I just think many have decided the trap isn’t that bad and have tried to find a way to get in on purpose.

        I know one guy that got in touch with me after almost 10 years and said “I am now retired” and he was quite proud of it. I was like really how, since he is about my age. Well he got his fat ass on disability, permanently. So he considers that actual “retirement”, he will collect until he dies now. I know full well this prick can work. So I get what you are saying, the two points are not exclusive of one another.

  13. your thoughts on Cecil were so close to my own thoughts it was scary last weekend I posted to my FB page: so here is my thoughts… if every person so outraged over the killing of the Cecil gave $20 to Zimbabwe for conservation then Zimbabwe wouldn’t need rich American trophy hunters. If you are outraged then put your money where your mouth is…. even better donate another $40 towards African relief efforts… Hundreds if not thousands of African children die every day from starvation/malnutrition… where is YOUR outrage that children still starve in 3rd world countries?