Episode-1293- Listener Feedback for 2-3-14 — 54 Comments

  1. Do you have a rough idea (weeks, month, multi-months) when the comfrey thing is going to get locked on?

    I’m about days from making massive plant purchases (a hundred or more) and am looking at purchasing roughly double that in comfrey, so obviously I’d like to wait a bit. (I don’t need to get the comfrey immediately with the plants and can wait, depending). I asked the wife about this last night and she said something like you said (i don’t remember this) April. Its not THAT big of a deal because I’m ok with getting what I’m looking for at coes for roughly 150 bucks or so.

    • @ The New Mike –

      If you’re willing to be patient, starting in year 2 you can have more comfrey than you could ever imagine. Just cut into the roots of your established plants, then snap those roots up into pieces around 2″ long. Plant those wherever you want new comfrey. Each one will spring up into a new plant.

      Trust me — I know this from personal experience. Coe’s great (I ordered from him last year), but comfrey is a plant that’s just too easy to propagate yourself.

      • Oh I totally understand. 100-150 dollars is chump change in the grand scheme of things. I I also want to get them going when I put in the plants that i’m doing. Just purchased over 400 dollars of trees last night. I’ll be doing the same all week. (Putting in roughly 3 small food forests in march/april). So i’d like to have everything rocking and rolling together. I’m loading up on the varieties so I can propagate out. The same with comfrey. I already have roughly 20 plants (although they look terrible right now).

        Thanks for the reply.

  2. Jack, I am gonna need you to stop predicting things. Ever since you predicted those accounts I have been watching for them, and now they are here. Depressing. I knew you would be right, and it still sucks. Cheers man. Will keep watching for more spirkodamous realities.

  3. Regarding the coding rant.
    Just heard “you could go through almost no conventional education and be the guy who does that work”. I can tell you unequivocally I consider that myself. As a software developer, until I had my current position, I had one intro C++ class almost a decade ago. I’ve never had real “computer” classes, (I’ve just been an “enthusiast”). Now I make uhm, decent money, I work from home, and own the project I work on. How? Personality and the will to learn and evolve.

  4. I find it interesting that Jack likes bitcoin so much while talking about takeovers of healthcare and retirement plans.

    Before someone tells me how I don’t understand bitcoin, I really do. I a geek, I know how to mine these things and move the around. I even like the general concept but I am not blind to its fundamental short comings.

    My first gripe is that it really is not private. You may be able to get you money out of the country or whatever via bitcoin but the moment you spend it it is traceable. If you think that doesn’t matter, ask yourself why foreign banks do no do business with US citizens, because the US government will intervene. If you think the IRS won’t follow you to the ends of the world for their pound of flesh, just because your flesh is denominated in a cryptocurrency, you are mistaken.

    My second gripe is by being a finite currency that can be traded for US dollars it can be manipulated. The major financial institutions manipulate every other tradable commodity and currency, why couldn’t or wouldn’t they manipulate bitcoin? They have all the fiat in the world to throw at it. Keep in mind that already the majority of bitcoin is held by exactly 8 wallets. Do you know who’s wallets those are? Do you know if those wallets are about to be confiscated by the FBI as some big ones already have? Turns out you really can arrest the money, we’ve doing it for decades with the war on drugs. No trial needed. Its value can be spiked or crashed at will by the big money. If it was really a threat or when it becomes one it will quickly crushed. Yes, its most attractive feature, the capped max size, it also its biggest weakness in our current world.

    Lastly, it is an illusion of freedom. It is a distraction. If I can use bitcoin I freed myself from the clutches of the system! Err no. You might feel better for doing it but it just a pin prick on the giant’s ankles, if it wasn’t it would have been stomped already. Instead the giant looks down, chuckles, and says carry on little man, if this is how you think you are free, then maybe you won’t pay attention to what I’m doing over here.

    I desperately want us to be free from the world of fiat currency and government control. I wish there was a way to do way with the monopoly of money, and hope someday something will work for that. I just don’t think it is bitcoin.

    Oh and btw, the are now about 100 competing cryptocurrencies. There are about 2 new ones every day. You might view that success but it is exactly the opposite as the more choices one has, the less likely one is to actually choose. Human nature is cruel that way.

    • “Yes, its most attractive feature, the capped max size, it also its biggest weakness in our current world.” I have to agree with this one. I think there’s a psychological barrier to spending such high value currency (even when we barter in metals, it tends to be silver, rather than gold from what I have seen).

      Sure, they can be fictionalized, but those fictionalizations will make it harder and harder to use. 0.0000000000000000000000002 BTC for a hamburger? shoot just last week it was 0.000000000000000000000002… see the point?

      Also, regarding the paper wallet system, bitcoins have already been permanently lost to the system because of user error. If someone had a paper wallet and died in a plane crash, that money is gone from the system forever, thus expediting the deflation.

      I understand bitcoin, and I understand that money is simply an agreement. I just think that bitcoin will most definitely not be the last or best crypto currency or even the one that gets full adoption eventually. This is an excellent explanation of how bitcoins work.

        • Sorry Jack, I agree with a lot but I think you have a bit over enthusiasm on the topic. I know you recently got into researching it more, but some of us have been watching this for a very long time. It is amusing to see how many people who have discovered bitcoin in the last 12 months are gungho and telling people they don’t understand something they can actually read the code of.

          You may think I don’t understand it, and that’s fine. Please answer me this: What prevents the banking institutions from buying enough bitcoins to upset the market. How sure are you they haven’t done so already?

          It is a simple enough question. Oh and don’t tell me that fractionalization means it doesn’t matter. If you are trading in satochi’s and JPM owns 50% of the bitcoins in existence, they own the currency.

          I understand why you find it attractive. I understand its value as a means of exchange. I understand its fractional nature, distributed network implementation, obscuring transactions through other cryptocurrencies, and all of those things. I want something like to succeed.

          I’m not even say it don’t use. It is a perfectly fine medium of exchange and the more people use it, the better it is for all of us the closer the better solution will be. Just please don’t tell me that it will in any way hurt the existing financial paradigm. Its successor might.

        • @Loch (sry wrong reply level) –
          I need to say something about the realities of ‘controlling’ BTC via ownership.. and ‘upsetting the market’.

          What prevents a banking institution from buying enough BTC to upset the market?
          A) Nothing. But, there are two problems with them doing so. First, it would only act as a DEFENSIVE tactic and second, it would cost them a shit ton of money.

          This also relates to ‘If you are trading Satoshi’s and JPM owns 50% of the BTC.. they own the currency.’

          Here is the major thought mistake..

          Owning the Money Owning the Printing Press

          So.. lets ignore BTC, and use something less emotional for a fictional story that will illustrate the bankers problem.

          An Insidious Parable:
          In the kingdom of imaginary land a group of thugs created a printing press, and convinced everyone that they should trade their lives for little pieces of paper (not going to tell you the whole story.. you know how this works).

          One day 100 golden eggs fell from the sky. Some villagers found them and thought to themselves, why don’t we trade these golden eggs with each other instead of those pieces of paper the thugs keep printing up.

          So they did. And the thugs got mad, because they needed new yachts, and more cocaine, and loved having people grovel to them for favors, and treat them like big shots..

          So they hatched a scheme.. ‘lets get a hold of all the golden eggs, and then they’ll have to use our paper again!’

          So they printed up a giant stack of paper, and went out into the village and began buying up the golden eggs.. the first one was cheap, $5. But the next one was $7, and by the end of the day they had to pay $1200 per egg! But, success.. they had ALL of the golden eggs.. and now people would have to sue their paper again.

          But the next day, another 100 golden eggs fell from the sky, and the people found them, and started trading with them again.. but now they were worth $1200/each, because that’s the price the bad men had paid the day before.

          The bad men were angry.. and printed an even larger pile of paper, rushed out into the marketplace, and began buying up all of the eggs.. but now they had a problem, the villagers knew that they would buy the eggs at any cost. So the price went up, and up and up.. $5000/egg, $11000/egg !! By the end of the day, they’d succeeded.. but their giant stack of paper was all gone.. and..

          the next day 100 golden eggs fell out of the sky.. now, the printing presses had to be run 24/7 just to make enough paper to buy the eggs..

          but this caused a problem.. they were printing so much paper money that hyper-inflation set in.. and now it cost $10M for an apple.. but you could get 10 apples for one golden egg..

          OK.. I’m teasing with the last part..

          But seriously.. if you don’t control the press, you DO NOT control the currency. You may have a lot of the currency. You may be able to influence the exchange rate of the currency, but you are not in control of it.

          And in the case of BTC, if you are using it as a mechanism of exchange, the exchange rate DOES NOT MATTER.

          If we conduct a transaction IN DOLLARS, and the exchange is facilitated by the BTC network.. it is immaterial if the exchange rate is $0.10/BTC or $1M/BTC.

          The only way to ‘shut down’ the network’ would be to BUY EVERY BTC in existence, so no one would be able to use a single Satoshi for exchange.. and you would have to keep buying them every ten minutes for the next 126 years (BTC mining will cease in 2140).

          And here’s the big joke.. lets say they try it.. and drive up the BTC price, and get control of ‘all’ of the BTC (or at least enough to hamper exchange).

          What happens? Well, what’s already happened.. someone takes the code base, changes one line to read ‘My-Even-Cooler-Coin’, and the game starts all over again.

          Goldman Sachs/the big banks are left with a network/currency that is worth $0 and takes five minutes to copy. People who had BTC to sell are happily retired. People that want to use crypto-currencies are forced to download a new type of wallet.

          In other words.. banks lose billions.. users get rich.. people using it for exchange take 20 minutes to swap to the new hot network.. and the game starts over.

          Propoganda is their ONLY WEAPON.

        • some stuff got truncated.. the major point was:

          Owning The Money
          is NOT equal to..
          Owning The Printing Press

        • @Jake –
          More FUD.. article states that miners are using 650 W/Gh.

          My current ASIC miners use 2W/Gh, and the next gen one I have on order should use 0.58 W/Gh.

          As that power is turned into ‘waste’ heat, it is currently being used to warm my office.

          So my heater is making me $$$


    • Oy. I was hoping to avoid another BTC apology piece, but people are getting awfully upset over nothing, and ignoring silly things like logic.

      What are the things people are using BTC for?
      – A ‘get rich quick’ vehicle
      – Speculation (gambling)
      – A currency (exchange between individuals)
      – A payment system/network (exchange between individuals and businesses, or transfer of money from one location to another)

      Now of those 4, Jack has suggested using it as a payment system, and (possibly) as a currency. He has not in anyway suggested that you should shift a percentage of your assets into BTC, nor has he suggested it as a long term store of value.

      So, if I’m an individual, or a business that uses BTC, what is the risk?
      A) That the BTC network will explode sometimes between me pressing the buy button, and the merchant receiving payment from the BTC processor.

      If I decide to use BTC to transfer money from one country to another what is the risk?
      A) That while I am flying to my foreign tax haven, the BTC network will be taken over by ‘the powers that be’ and I my BTC will be rendered worthless.

      Are there any advantages to using BTC instead of say Paypal or a CC to buy stuff?
      A) Yes. The person you are buying from will not be gouged by ‘the powers that be’ for the transaction. You will be defunding them. And if ‘they’ want to know what you’re buying its going to be a lot more work to track than it currently is. Not to mention all of the ‘other partners’ that every payment processor shares information with. (Do you believe for a second that the NSA doesn’t get regular downloads from Visa/Mastercard and Paypal?)

      So, hitting the BTC button, instead of the Paypal/CC button (wow.. fighting for liberty is SO HARD!!) defunds big business, makes big gov uncomfortable, and lets small business keep more money..

      BUT.. you don’t want to do it because SOMETIME in the future, something MIGHT happen, that could be BAD, in a way that you really can’t define.

      Yes. Our supreme dictator/oligarchy COULD make it retroactively illegal to use BTC and drag us all off to a FEMA camp where we’re forced to eat government cheese and make Nike’s for $0.40/day.

      Goldman Sachs COULD buy all the BTC in existence and CONTROL the currency.. for.. oh wait, how would that work.. no way to short it..

      But.. yeah, bad things!!


      There is only one ‘risk’ RIGHT NOW which is currency volatility.. and that is only a risk if you HOLD the currency.

      So seriously.. ?!??

      Don’t hold the currency.

      And the hamburger argument has already been covered, by me, elsewhere.
      If 1 BTC = $1M.. you use Satoshis for everything.

      But again.. who cares. RIGHT NOW you can USE BTC and it gets big gov and big bizs panties in a bunch (and defunds/disempowers them). That’s more than enough reason to use it RIGHT NOW.

      What happens in the future, happens in the future.. we can deal with it then.

      There will never be an ULTIMATE solution for ALL TIME.. we need to do what works NOW, until it doesn’t work. And then move on to the next thing that works..

      • The issue is not the medium of exchange part. We are in agreement.

        Your earlier conversation about printing presses and golden eggs is flawed exactly because of the medium of exchange part. There are at least two qualities of money that are somewhat important. Medium of exchange and store of value. You can’t really have without the other, because while people may use bitcoin as a medium of exchange SOMEONE has to hold it. You never want to be the last guy on a game of musical chairs, and what you are saying is that volatility doesn’t matter because you are never the one holding it “money” when the music stops.

        Yous say that the price would increase as the commodity gets manipulated and bought by a party trying to control it. Except that every other commodity controlled works the opposite way. When you control enough of it, you can run derivatives, buy on credit and control the price up and down, force crashes, and buy the dips. It happens every day with other commodities. Amusingly the seeming anonymity of bitcoin wallets means this can be done easier not harder.

        BTW, there is already a bitcoin EFT in the works and some pseudo-derivatives.

        I’m not saying don’t use, I’m saying its odds of actually hurting the system are null. I wish I’m wrong, btw. I’m just pretty sure I’m not.

      • @Loch – (sry no reply button)

        Manipulation of markets requires the ability to either SHORT said market, or to create a derivative of the underlying commodity and convince someone they should hold the derivative instead of the actual thing.

        This reduces the speculative possibilities for a Goldman Sachs type play to a ‘hold and wait’ strategy. Yes, there are people that want to create such things, and they will exist at some point.. but again, none of this destroys the networks usefulness as a mechanism of exchange.. it only effects the exchange rate.

        Whipsawing the market price would allow you to buy up all of the BTC more cheaply, but it would not change the underlying issue that ultimately, for all of your effort, you would have wasted a lot of time and energy on a bag full of nothing. I’m not saying it won’t happen.. it would be a good way to ‘prove’ that crypto-currencies ‘don’t work’.. but it would have no effect on the networks ability to work as a medium of exchange.

        As for the ‘store of value’ argument.. @TheNewMike will bludgeon me with arguments concerning its lack of ‘intrinsic value’ and convincing me to buy more gold.. (ahhh! 😉

        So I’m not going to say anything about that..

        There are just two points I’d make about it..
        1) It can be used to facilitate exchange more cheaply and with less control than any other existing exchange mechanism (CC, Debit Cards, Paypal, etc.). None of its competition in this area is ‘money’ either, and exactly ALL of the arguments against BTC can be made against these competing exchange mechanisms.

        2) If we regard it as money, and start comparing it to FIAT currencies of approximately the same overall dollar value.. they have EXACTLY the same arguments against them as BTC (manipulation, control, value destruction via speculation).. AND they have the added risk of an uncontrolled (by the people) PRINTING PRESS.

        So.. ‘someone has to hold it’.. well, you could say that Visa ‘holds’ the value of all in process exchanges in their network, but like BTC, you’re talking about a JOURNAL of ACCOUNT.. there is no actual ‘thing’ that is held.. its all just marks in a ledger. So if exchanges like Coinbase exist, they need those ‘marks’ to keep their service running.. so they’ll ‘hold’ what they need to conduct their business. But its the equivalent of tally sticks.. they’re just ‘markers’ (Think SWIFT interbank system).

        Money doesn’t exist. Its a shared delusion.

      • Darn reply button is killing me too.

        The issue with store of value is not the long term holding power, this isn’t “gold holds its value argument”, it is a short term issue. A significant holding, combined with derivatives and other tools can make the value volatile in the short term. We live in the world of HFTs and derivatives markets in the hundreds of trillions.

        If I was a bank that wanted bitcoin dead all I would have to do is shuffle some money into inducing a 5 to 10% percent volatility on any given day. No vendor will want to go to sleep holding bitcoin because that could be its entire margin so now we are back to the musical chairs game. If vendors won’t go to sleep holding it, it is effectively dead, or at the very least it will fail to win a significant market share.

        The same banks could do that to the dollar, Euro, or whatever else, but it is not in their interest because it leads to revolutions or at the very least serious anger on the part of someone with a navy. Soros might have gotten a way with messing with the pound, but you will note people don’t do that major currencies that way anymore. However .. to a currency they will paint as a criminal, tax dodging tool? If they think it is a threat they will do it in a second, because there is no Bitcoin Navy and they will have the tacit approval of the nationals who’s currency and tax revenue is threatened.

        You don’t need to own all of bitcoin to screw with it, all you have to do is induce a mild concern about its overnight stability. It is already a bit to complex for the average person, add the doubt over its value and you can contain it to a small market. You don’t even need to kill it, you can let be the illusion of freedom to the few troublemakers, which why I said it can be used a distraction. The true believers will spend way to long thinking it will work only if they convince enough people, all the while the value and utility of the coin declines until one by one they move to something else, a little bit more disillusioned, a little more beaten, a little less likely to fight the system.

        Yes, I paint a depressing picture, but that is because I don’t believe it is any threat to the system.

        • starting @ the bottom.. 😉

          guerrilla war – Your enemy has more resources than you.. so to win, take low cost actions that cost your opponent big.

          This isn’t the war.. it’s just a battle.. you don’t have to win, it just has to cost the enemy more than it does you.

          The enemy is not monolithic, its a crowd of competing elites. They are seeking advantage.. but over each other as much as over us. This can be exploited.

          Some elites will benefit by the destruction of crypto currencies, but others benefit by their success.

          How do we play these elements against each other? What low cost actions can we take?

          Forget depression.. its debilitating. Lets keep this light, play a fun game, be system griefers, dance while the dinosaur dies.

          Save the energy for an extra fire ant sting.


        • @Loch you said,

          “If I was a bank that wanted bitcoin dead all I would have to do is shuffle some money into inducing a 5 to 10% percent volatility on any given day.”

          This is very difficult there are no derivatives of bitcoin, no shorts or longs to play, no options on it. To buy it you have to get people to sell it, there are at this time only about 12.5 million coins that have been mined, there will only ever be 20 million. There are only so many available to be bought, you can’t use contracts to tie them up, they have to be directly bought so sellers must be willing to give them up.

          The best you could do is drive the price though the roof and get a bunch of people to sell. Problem is if you hold it the price stays up because the coins you took in have zero velocity now. If you dump them the next day, sure the price may go down but it will end up stabilizing about where it started. In other words it nothing but a scare tactic.

          Consider the GDP of just Birmingham AL is about 40 billion dollars. With bitcoins at 1000 a coin and fully mined they would have a total economy of 20 billion or 20 thousand million, only half of Birmingham AL’s GDP for a currency that can be used anywhere in the world.

          It is funny that the only people obsessed with bitcoins volatility are the ones not using it.

      • @Insidious
        Dear Insidious,
        Do not drag me into your protracted bitcoin battle. HAHAHAH

        I shall not comment on this because I’m definitely on both sides of the issue. Like I’ve said before, the ability to use it as an “oh shit currency” where you can move to another place and still maintain some sort of buying, is the only reason I got into it. Everything else about it is trying to shoot problems with silver arrows, which while seemingly exist, is so overkill it introduces new problems.

        Like I’ve said, we’re we’re going is much more distributed trade and societies. Bitcoin’s only real appeal is globalized insantaneous monetary transfers. I personally think garlic bulbs are a better monetary asset than bitcoins for everyday things. =)

        Have fun ya’ll.

  5. One of our vendors at my job is a member of C.R.A.P.
    Californian’s Re-educating Aggressive Persons.

    He happen to walk in while I was listening to the podcast. He said Jack is a meanie and is not helping the climate change problems by complaining about California. I threw some raw meat at him and made him run away in fear.

    I’m kidding. I really enjoyed the podcast today. I used some of the stories Jack commented on and passed it on to my employees. Excellent show!

  6. “I bet there are places in this country where you need a permit to dig a hole.” I’m in the county in WA state, not city, and if you move over 10 yards of dirt you supposed to get a permit for digging a hole. I was curious about a putting in a pond and found that piece 🙁 They do patrol for ponds by aircraft 🙁

  7. Yes, Jack there is that place where you need a permit to dig a hole. Actually the truth may be just a little more crazy than that. I have a customer in Saline township just south of Ann Arbor MI who had to get a permit to dig out stumps, before they would even begin to entertain a building permit.

    In places like this there are layers of permits that need to be obtained from multiple government departments.

    Drives me nuts!

    • @BarnGeek

      Wow, that nuts! I guess they’re afraid of the chaos that would ensue if people began digging up stumps on their own. Can you imagine the horror?

      Just like the mafia. They gotta get their cut. I’m probably being unfair to the mob.

      • Ah, but it’s not just code enforcement that gets their cut. You have to get an environmental assesment by an engineer, to make sure you don’t erode anything or disturb the delicate balance of the ecosystem in your back yard.

        Now, I’m all about being a good stewart with the earth we have been given, but come on!

        We have a saying here….well I just made it up.

        “Everytime a code is written an engineer gets their wings”

        No, offence to the engineers we actually need, of course.

        • Hey man, they just don’t want your dog to break a leg in the hole left from the stump. What’s that, your against it? Tell me, what do you have against dogs?

          Seriously, just tell them that you destroyed the ant-dominant ecosystem and made one for the frogs.

          Screw it, I don’t know. Ignore the rules and get everyone else to do it to, I guess.

    • Both Kansas and Missouri do. ‘Every digging job requires a call’ to 811 for Kansas. ‘Missouri law requires that any person making or beginning any excavation notify MOCS…’ and give ‘digging a hole to plant a small bush’ as an example. says a violation is subject to a civil penalty of up to $10,000 per violation per day, possibly totaling up to $500,000.
      No wonder my neighbor looked at me funny when I answered no when he asked if I called 811 when he saw me digging a hole to plant a 2 foot blue spruce last spring.

  8. Jack you hit the nail on the head AGAIN. Another great episode. I have learned so much from you over the last year. Plea keep doing this as you help people like myself understand somethings we may have no clue about. WOW

  9. Does not “If you don’t hold it, you don’t own it”, seem contrary to Bitcoin?

    I’m not on board, I will wait and let others take the risk.

    • Actually it doesn’t apply because

      1. You an hold it if you really want to, it is called a paper wallet.

      2. It isn’t phyical, so the rules of gold and silver don’t apply.

      3. You can convert it instantly to cash, gold, silver or a beer, and hold that.

      Too many years of gold and silver being called money but sold as an investment by the same people calling it money have confused people.

  10. Point #1, Ok, I just found:
    Point #2, ya, got that now
    Point #3, You can convert gold, silver to those items as well, so I can’t see that as an advantage over any other currency

    So, maybe it’s because I just dont get Bitcoin, but unjustly or not, I am still having a mental block trusting it /Tin foil hat.

    As I said, I will watch comfortably from here. I’ve heard Stephane Molyneaux and Peter go at it , and I tend to lean toward Peter on this on, since the only real thing backing it up is the electricity needed to generate them. (Peter’s quote not mine)…

    • @Brent, again, I get that you don’t get it. LOL, it also won’t cost me a single wink if you never use a bitcoin in your life. I still say your entire concern is unfounded, using bitcoin doesn’t require holding bitcoin.

      Now you don’t sell anything so that changes things a bit I guess. I mean a business today has to be foolish to not accept bitcoin, like really dumb, I know I was up till now.


      I never have to hold a bitcoin to accept them, I choose to but I do not have to.

      Joe wants to buy MSB but loves bitcoin, he spends his money where they take it and support it. I want Joe’s business but I am competing with other companies for it, Joe isn’t made of money so he picks and chooses what he buys.

      To get Joe’s business I need to take bitcoin but I am scared of the bitcoin cookie monster because I don’t comprehend bitcoin. What can I do? I mean Joe is the diamond in the world of business, we call his business incremental revenue!

      Simple I set up an account at Coinbase, works a lot like paypal. I take payments in bitcoin but I link my coinbase account to my bank account and tell coin base, convert 100% of all my received funds to USD and deposit them to my account.

      Now I get Joe’s business, I get dollars, Joe gets to use his bitcoins and my fees even with coinbase and conversion are about HALF of what PayPal or a credit card company takes.


      Oh and if I am Target or Walmart I am likely saving six figures in fees per week per store, so watch the big retailers do it soon! Also unlike a merchant account, money taken in via bitcoin is immediately useable.

    • Oh and conversion of gold and silver vs. bitcoin, bitcoin wins.

      To convert gold and silver you much physically go somewhere, they pay you less than spot and likely you are taxed on the gain. If you do it in the mail you have shipping and costs. If you buy local you pay sales tax and if you sell local you lose the sales tax paid on your sale it is part of your total cost.

      This means you buy an ounce of silver locally, it goes up 10%! Woot you made two dollars, when you sell it you WILL TAKE A LOSS on a commodity that went up.

  11. You are correct, I don’t sell anything, and in your case, yes it is wise to expand method of payment and it makes more options available for you. And 2nd post, yes I do lose when I convert silver to $ (capital gains)

    So at this point, I am *partially* getting it LOL. I will watch and learn at this point. This Bitcoin is all new to me and I am not well versed in it..

    • Better a little caution, than a great regret 😉

      I would suggest that rather than trying to figure out ‘the whole’ and evaluate that for risk, that they look at a specific action, and evaluate that.

      For example:
      What is the risk of setting up a Coinbase account?

      What is the risk of using Coinbase (or a competing service) to debit my bank account and pay a merchant with BTC?

      What is the risk, as a merchant, of accepting BTC, in addition to the CC & Paypal that you already accept, if it is immediately converted to dollars and deposited into your bank account?

      Evaluating the ‘meta risk’ is much more difficult, as there is no statistical methodology, or history, to use in determining risk. In other words, what people state ‘will happen’ is opinion based on speculation.

      • Good stuff and when you ask those questions here are my answers…

        What is the risk of setting up a Coinbase account?

        Nothing it is free, as secure as any online banking and only has money in it that you put into it or accept into it.

        What is the risk of using Coinbase (or a competing service) to debit my bank account and pay a merchant with BTC?

        Little to none, could Coinbase rip off its customers and shut the doors and skip off to tin buck two, I guess but they have been around a long time. As to my bank account I have fraud protection and they only get access to one account, that holds very little money at any one time. I guess paypal could skip off with our money too but both they and coinbase seem really happy with the valuable business they built.

        What is the risk, as a merchant, of accepting BTC, in addition to the CC & Paypal that you already accept, if it is immediately converted to dollars and deposited into your bank account?

        Zero, all that happens is you get more business and pay lower fees.

        But hell run away anyway, the sky is falling bitcoin is a bubble just like tulip bulbs were. Sigh!

        • @Jack
          “What is the risk of setting up a Coinbase account? Nothing it is free…”
          Nonsense. You have to provide much more personal information and of a sensitive nature, to a company you don’t know. I do agree its some what the same as any other website but there is no real way to judge that (other than through testimonials). All the information you provide them is definitely usable in identity theft (although I’ll argue using an email address on any website could actually provide those avenues, but that’s another story). The same argument can is used to support the government. What’s wrong with providing the information to the government? Or providing it to Google? We both know specific instances where that makes it not such a good idea. Google is one of the worst, yet most people don’t seem to know that…

          There are other issues like converting BTC to cash. (Probably getting better everyday, but I don’t know this for fact) I know you say its easy but that depends. Its like with MT Gox. There are quite a number of people who have thousands ]of dollars locked up at MTGox. Possibly from a merchants standpoint of “I want to sell bitcoin for US dollars” it might not be too bad to use Coinbase, but from a purchaser of bitcoin. Yeah right. Voilatility locks up Coinbase at least from the purchasingn side (I hadn’t seen if it locks up on the selling side, but its generally a two way street).

          I’ve worked with coinbase and had issues with them with the way they do business. Everything eventually did turned out alright, but it took multiple emails and at least a month of waiting. They have a habit of cancelling your order for no reason, regardless if you do business with them regularly. Its not their policy to make good on their deals with you unless you pester them.

  12. Alright, last BTC comment.. (I hope) 😉

    To keep the propaganda campaign from working (BTC = evil) ordinary people need to be seen/known to be conducting business with it.

    This is similar to the evolution of thoughts about homeschoolers:

    ‘They’re all weirdo religious freaks! Without high school, how will they become socialized? They’ll be outcasts from society if the don’t experience prom!

    Wait.. Joe was home schooled and he’s normal.. in fact he’s pretty smart and well adjusted.. maybe homeschooling isn’t so bad.’

    Kind of like Muslim = terrorist. If you know a Muslim, and he isn’t a terrorist, then when you hear the propaganda machine spew that bit of BS, it slides right off.

    So, if you don’t know someone who uses BTC, publicly use BTC. And then when your neighbor sees that CSI episode where BTC are being used to buy babies so their stem cells can be harvested.. they’ll remember that their GOOD neighbor, uses BTC.. and have a chuckle, rather than being indoctrinated.

  13. Jack,
    Do you have a rough time frame when the guest form might pop back up?
    The wife has been pestering me to send the form to a guy we met at Ben Falk’s that absolutely 100% needs to be on this show. The guy is an incredible… “Just fuck it i’m doing it” kinda person. He lives completely off grid, and does whatever he wants on his property, regardless of legality (he lives in New York). He lives off less than 10k a year, has no job, and does everything from scratch generally by himself. He dabbles in just about every topic related to permaculture.

  14. This was truely a great podcast! It helped me put to words so many things I see happening in our world. Thank you VERY much Jack!

    Let me tell you people you can try to walk to freedom anywhere you want, but unless something changes there is only freedom as long as you do not get put before a court. The not at all great state of Texas via an evil public procuter did violance agains me. Beleive me there is no law and at the very best if you cant proove you are innocent then you WILL BE guitly. Without a true rule of law you dont have anything, but a thug police state and while we all pass judgement on people who have been convicted of crime and not us, let me reassure you that its ONLY because your all capital name has not come before a court YET. There IS something you are doing now that IS against some law.

    I once had hope that people might wake up some day, and they may yet.. However, what I see is things like police killing people over traffic fines and walking away with impunity. The loss of american freedom is not comming, buddy its already happened! The state does what ever they want there is no true law. Even in court the judge has the audacity to tell the jury what they are going to do. I any of you ever get on a jury be sure you question everything and make the RIGHT decision reguardless of what the law says. Its the ONLY chance we might have left. However, be prepaired to be held in contempt of cort for asking the right questions and not doing what the judge tells you to do!

    As for bitcoin, I accept it to just to support it. If this gets to big they will outlaw it or outlaw cryptography all together. However, the way I see thing going is one of two ways. 1)The violence the government will wake people up IF they punch it to far to fast, but more likely they will back off just a touch and people will accept it as they are now. Two steps forward and once back. They have done this for centuries and made a trillions off the public cattle, I mean people. They are very aware of what happens when they push to far; they have studied our minds in detail for this very purpose. 2) The people will wake up and simply start doing the right thing, they will go broke and start jailing and killing us as they die, but in the end just start world war 3 and restructure to maintain control while remaining hidden. I always said I would never be involved in a way, but perhaps there is a time and a place to die for our future generations sake for what is right.

    I hope people wake up, but its hard to see any such thing happening. Hell as it stands if I fail to wear a seat belt they will fine me, if I refuse to pay the fine they will jail me, if I refuse to go to jail they will kill me.. All because I did not protect me self? Get real, you and I all know all these laws a WRONG at their very foundation and as long as we chase our tail on pointless things like this how will we ever deal with the larger problem.

    In all of human history people who wanted to take responsibility for their lifes and live or die free by their own choices have moved to new lands. This time there is no new land to which flee towards and with modern warfare it would mean nothing if they did. This conflict will be THE end game. Fighting violance with violance will not end in a good way. I think Jack has nailed the only thing that can work. People need complete apathy towards government. This is not easy because if this thing goes very far the tax rate on land will just go to an inpossible level then where will you we live? They will remove the support on which we stand, even if they have to license tree planting to stop permaculture and land ownership.

    I challenge all of you to not watch TV or listen to any radio for 90 days. Spend your time thinking for your self and draw your own conclusions about everythign based on the true facts; do the research. It will change you life!!!

    Somewhere we will have to live spiritual lives for real change to happen. Does not matter what your higher power is so long as is not one that brings death and destruction, or elevate one man over another. However, after reading some of Rudolf Steiners books its clear that the powers that be are very aware of this aspect and are most likely prepaired for this next shift where they will provide a satisfying alernative to true spiritual life.

    Let me leave you with this quote from 1872, New York bankers sent a letter to every bank in the United States, urging them to fund newspapers that opposed government-issued money (Lincoln’s greenbacks).

    “Dear Sir: It is advisable to do all in your power to sustain such prominent daily and weekly newspapers… as will oppose the issuing of greenback paper money, and that you also withhold patronage or favors from all applicants who are not willing to oppose the Government issue of money. Let the Government issue the coin and the banks issue the paper money of the country… [T]o restore to circulation the Government issue of money, will be to provide the people with money, and will therefore seriously affect your individual profit as bankers and lenders.” — Triumphant plutocracy; the story of American public life from 1870 to 1920, by Lynn Wheeler

    “It will not do to allow the greenback, as it is called, to circulate as money any length of time, as we cannot control that.” — Triumphant plutocracy; the story of American public life from 1870 to 1920, by Lynn Wheeler

    “Slavery is likely to be abolished by the war power, and chattel slavery destroyed. This, I and my European friends are in favor of, for slavery is but the owning of labor and carries with it the care for the laborer, while the European plan, led on by England, is for capital to control labor by controlling the wages. THIS CAN BE DONE BY CONTROLLING THE MONEY.” — Triumphant

  15. One more thing about the future of bit coin. It will take some real dertermination of people using it for it to stand. Check this out..

    Germany’s state-issued value based currency was also a direct threat to the wealth and power of the private central banks, and as early as 1933 they started to organize a global boycott against Germany to strangle this upstart ruler who thought he could break free of private central bankers!

    As had been the case in World War One, Great Britain and other nations threatened by Germany’s economic power looked for an excuse to go to war, and as public anger in Germany grew over the boycott, Hitler foolishly gave them that excuse. Years later, in a spirit of candor, the real reasons for that war were made clear.

    “The war wasn’t only about abolishing fascism, but to conquer sales markets. We could have, if we had intended so, prevented this war from breaking out without doing one shot, but we didn’t want to.”- Winston Churchill to Truman (Fultun, USA March 1946)

    “Germany’s unforgivable crime before WW2 was its attempt to loosen its economy out of the world trade system and to build up an independent exchange system from which the world-finance couldn’t profit anymore. …We butchered the wrong pig.” -Winston Churchill (The Second World War – Bern, 1960)

  16. Jack, thanks for all the info and getting involved in with bitcoin. I have had a ton of questions about it, but you have pretty much answered them all and Insidious knows it inside and out.

    But, I’m going to comment on your take about all politicians make you sick. I try and explain how both sides are screwing us royally, mainly to my liberal friends as they tend to be more fanatical, but not by much. As one who spent half his life in high levels of the Fed Gov and has listened to many highly sensitive conversations concerning our country, you are dead on. If Americans understood exactly what our politicians are doing to us there would be a revolt tomorrow. That is why I left I just couldn’t take it anymore, I had to leave for my sole and that is why I now teach people about proper health and nutrition.

    You were dead on with that statement as well, if people just changed their diet and were able to think clearly they would wake up and realize they are being being completely screwed. I love what you do, and when you talk it is like hearing my own words at times. The good news people are starting to wake up, and I hope some serious changes are coming, because if not we are doomed as a country.

  17. Yes, I got red flagged for digging a hole without a permit. 3 years ago we had storm water runoff from the poorly designed city street drainage that flooded our front walk and porch. I decided to dig and install a 2 foot wide by 35 foot long by 1 foot deep attractive creek bed filled with river rock in front of our front porch walk to catch this runoff so that we didn’t have to walk through 6 inches of water to get to our front door every time in rained. I started digging on a Sunday afternoon and when I got home from work on Monday, I was greeted by a red flag on a stake that pounded into my front yard. I was forced to get an F’ing permit to dig a trench on my own property to collect (on site) the run off from the city’s street. I sold the house a year later, moved just a couple miles out of city limits and now do whatever the hell I want thanks to a long driveway and a gate.

  18. I caught parts of the show as I listened to it in bed and fell asleep, I’ll have to listen again .. but if you get a decent supplier of mushroom sawdust spawn, with a good discount deal on that I may have to consider joining the MSB