Episode-390- Eight News Stories You Should Know About
Podcast: Play in new window | Download (26.3MB)
Today we discuss eight news stories you won’t hear in main stream national media. They each tell us something about our future and effect us as modern survivalists. While I generally focus on solutions once in a while it is good to stay in touch with current and emerging problems so that we can can continue to adapt our solutions.
Tune in today as we discuss these eight stories
- A couple is prosecuted for a Xeriscape front law by the City of Orange California (Link to Source Story) – (video of this story)
- The EU Authorizes GMO Potatoes (Link to Source Story)
- A common weed-killer castrates frogs – And the EPA says they won’t regulate
it? (Link to Source Story) - China is going into the GMO business (Link to Source Story)
- Bill O’Reilly says it is okay to seize your guns during an emergency like
Katrina (Link to Source Story) - Mark Faber says buy gold and farmland and prepare for a “dirty war” (Link to Source Story)
- A 775% Tax Increase (Link to Source Story)
- It is now officially “The Great Recession” (Link to Source Story)
Additional Resources for Today’s Show
- Members Support Brigade
- TSP Gear Shop
- Join Our Forum
- SOE Tactical Gear – (sponsor of the day)
- The Berkey Guy – (sponsor of the day)
- TSP’s YouTube Channel
- Truth Brigade (I will be a guest on tonight)
- Mastering the 22 Rifle (my eBook due out soon)
- Ron Hood’s Survival.com Magazine
Remember to comment, chime in and tell us your thoughts, this podcast is one man’s opinion, not a lecture or sermon. Also please enter our listener appreciation contest and help spread the word about our show. Also remember you can call in your questions and comments to 866-65-THINK and you might hear yourself on the air.
Hey Jack,
Loved the show.The Video link to the OC “Desert Garden” is broken… Thank you for covering this story. what can we do to support this family and tell “The OC” where stick this insane “rule”. (SO.Ca got how much rain in the last 5 years,Before this years El NINO) TSPers, especially in SO CA can not afford to alow this kind of stupidy to happen in the place we are living! We have NO WATER in So Ca and a LAW REQUIRES OC houses to have 40% “LIVE” landscaping… Why do we let these IDIOTS run our lives?
Just for clarity, an “organic compound” is one that includes a carbon atom. It has nothing whatsoever to do with what we call ‘organic’ farming or how the compound is manufactured. Just think back to first year organic chemistry – no green plants there.
Atrazine is an organic compound but it has nothing to do with nature. It just has carbon in its molecules.
RE: Great Recession label
I agree. My Dad was born in 1928, the youngest of 12 children whose father died in 1933. What we are experiencing now is nowhere close to the Great Depression that my dad described, so this game that the press and politicians are playing with words leaves a bad taste.
Hi Jack,
This is nit-picky, so apologies in advance, but “Monsanto” is pronounced Mon-SAN-toe (as in SAN Fransisco), not Mon-SAUN-toe (as in “sit in my SAUNa to relax”).
It’s like you’re saying “Exxon Mobeel” or “Microsooft.”
Not to be a dick about it. Just want to be sure you’re taken credibly when you talk about it.
@Peter I know exactly how to pronounce Monsanto, I say it the way I do as a dig, as in disgust for them. If anyone questions my creditability for that, well they can just find another source of information to utilize.
http://reason.com/archives/2009/04/21/yielding-to-ideology-over-scie
“Yielding to Ideology Over Science:
Why don’t environmentalists celebrate modern farming on Earth Day?”
I thought you might enjoy this article from Reason Magazine. It presents a well-reasoned counterpoint to your view of GMO/BT crops.
@Peter,
I think that article is a terrible piece of propaganda. It simply ignores the risks and damage proven to be a part of GMOs. Such as the recent proof that Monsanto GMO corn causes organ damage. It ignores MY RIGHT to choose not to eat this bullshit. It ignores how my right and YOUR RIGHT to not consume this is blocked by the making labeling food “GMO Free” illegal.
It ignores cross pollination which can not be prevented. It ignores the research that has been done with terminator genes. It ignores the FACT that the way you splice a gene from a fish into a plant is by using a VIRUS.
There is absolutely NOTHING well reasoned in that article because it never addresses the main concerns that informed opponents to GMOs have.
Hi Jack,
I think “propaganda” is a little strong. It’s just an editorial by a person with a different point of view than your own.
I have read the studies on the health impact of BT corn, and it is concerning. Respectfully, however, corn with a side of health problems is better than no corn at all–at least from the perspective of the world’s starving population. Ideally, the current “crop” of BT corn is a stepping stone to BT corn that does not cause disparate health issues.
Were you not persuaded by the author’s contention that GMO crops allow for better land usage and thus less usage of crop treatments (like atrazine)?
I’m not convinced by your “right not to eat GMO” argument. Maybe I’m misunderstanding it? How does your right to no GMO’s out-weigh someone else’s right to eat, or have access to foods with enhanced nutrient content. It seems a little like the Brady Campaign’s claim that their right to enjoy Starbucks without guns out-weighs your right to self protection.
I do completely agree with you that food suppliers and sellers should have the ability to market “GMO free” foods as such, although its because I’m a free-market proponent, not because I’m particularly worried about BT exposure.
On a side note, do you read and are you generally a fan of Reason Magazine (this particular article aside)? It seems to be right up your alley–free markets, free thinking, libertarian-slant. They had a great article today about the constitutionality of firearm carrying outside the home, and how the issue may come up in light of yesterday’s Supreme Court hearings. You should check it out. (http://reason.com/archives/2010/03/03/carry-on)
@Peter, I think you are affiliated with this publication and attempting to promote it, you picked the wrong topic to do this. As to your question NO I was not, “persuaded by the author’s contention that GMO crops allow for better land usage and thus less usage of crop treatments” because this is a false contention.
Fact – GMO soy leads to MORE not LESS spraying as it is designed to be sprayed.
Fact – GMO Soy doesn’t fix nitrogen at normal rates and leads therefore to MORE not LESS chemical fertilizer.
Fact – GMO plants INVADE THE BIOSPHERE and cross pollinate beyond our control and will have long term consequences that could be very severe.
As for this nonsense statement you made,
“I’m not convinced by your “right not to eat GMO” argument. Maybe I’m misunderstanding it? How does your right to no GMO’s out-weigh someone else’s right to eat, or have access to foods with enhanced nutrient content.”
Because the rights of one party don’t extend to the right to damage the lives and properties of others. Farmer A wants to offer GMO free corn, a farmer on the other side of the road grows GMO corn which invades Farmer A’s field. Farmer A is harmed, his customers are harmed and the way Monsanto works they are likely to sue Farmer A for patent infringement.
GMOs are NOT free market consistent because the obstruct the rights and freedoms of others. GMO crops infect the crops of other producers that don’t want to use them, they are forced into the market by a current legal system that denies people the right to even know what they are choosing to eat. Monsanto, Conagra and others like them are far from examples of anything we could call a true free market. Debating an article like this is like shooting fish in a barrel. It has ZERO substance behind it. The only real claim is GMO = Higher Yields.
Well if we used the bodies of children as compost that would also increase yields. In effect that is what we are doing here.
Finally the fact that these companies patent life forms is so far from anything approaching a “free market” as to make any such claims look fully ignorant to reality. Monsanto for instance has patented seeds from Iraq that they didn’t even engineer.
http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_7152.cfm
Your claims that GMOs have anything to do with a free market make me question your understanding of the term.
Hi Jack,
I don’t work for Reason Magazine. Actually, I’m not even a subscriber. It’s really no skin off my back if you choose to read it or not. Apologies if my suggestion of two articles I thought you may find interesting set off your acute sense of paranoia. Did you read the article about constitutionality of carrying handguns outside the home? I still think you’d enjoy that one.
It’s clear that you’re no fan of BT crops, and you’re certainly entitled to your opinion. I’m just trying to present an alternate view, (even if such views are defacto “propaganda” to your mind).
The fact remains that a growing population on this planet requires solutions to its ever-increasing nutritional needs. BT is not a perfect solution, but I don’t believe anyone is making that claim. It is, however, a necessary part of the solution. Your demonizing of BT is neither productive nor (fully) accurate. Your concerns are valid, and as stated earlier, I share several of them.
So what is the solution? Permaculture can’t feed the entire world. To even come close would require global regulation of private property so draconian it would make your worst fears of HOA rules look rather trifling. Perhaps you have another solution to share.
Food Inc.–I’m going out on a (very small) limb by guessing you’ve seen it–is an entertaining film, but about as fair to farmers and seed and food companies as “Bowling for Columbine” is to gun owners and manufacturers. As is the case with most contentious topics, the truth lies somewhere in the middle.
@Peter indeed Permaculture can solve the problem. You are also fixated on BT, clearly showing your understanding of the issue is VERY limited in scope. BT is a problem but it is far for the biggest issue I have with GMOs as a whole. BT is ONE GMO trait.
Hi Jack,
I don’t think BT means what you think it means… (What do you think “BT” means?)
http://www.extension.org/faq/25959
I’m glad you pointed out the misunderstanding. If we’re not using terms in the same way, it does become tough to have a conversation.
I’d be interested to hear how you envision permaculture “solving the problem.” If possible at all, the logistics behind that solution would boggle the mind. You’d need global governance to even attempt it, and I don’t think that’s something you’re in favor of.
Perhaps you’ve done a show on Permaculture as the solution to world hunger that I haven’t heard. If you point me to the episode, I would gladly listen it it. I can recall an episode where you suggested every US neighborhood replacing ornamental and non-fruit bearing trees with producing trees, but I’m sure you’ll agree there’s more to the solution than that. Particularly in terms of enforcement and logistics, and getting the food to where it needs to be.
With population density being what it is, I would be very skeptical of any one method being touted as being the solution–permaculture included. I live 8 miles outside of NYC. If you draw a circle around my house with a 50 mile radius, you are likely to encircle between 18-20 million people. The most productive stats I’ve read on permaculture suggested a 2 acre plot fed about 400 people–with vegetables and fruit only–for 49 weeks of the year. Translated, that would take 100,000 acres to feed the people only fruits and vegetables within a 50 mile radius of my home–for 49 weeks of the year.
The problem is compounded by the fact that a permaculture system takes years to function optimally. I would need some serious convincing that that is THE solution. It might be PART of the solution…
@Peter get your info for better sources, BT means
Bacillus thuringiensis
It is what anyone means when they in general say say BT-corn. Bt corn is a variant of maize, genetically altered to express the bacterial Bt toxin, which is poisonous to insect pests. In the case of corn, the pest is the European Corn Borer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacillus_thuringiensis
If you want to know how Permaculture can solve world hunger watch the global gardener series on Google video from Bill Mollison, read “Permaculture One” and The Permaculture Designers Manual. Mollison has done a far better job of laying out the case than I can hope to.
@marauder,
See that is the thing, Permaculture isn’t “a technique” it is the observance and emulation of natural patterns. It evolves, as long as ethics are followed it is “permaculture”. There are quite honestly tens of thousands of permaculture techniques.
When it comes to transgenic crops, there really isn’t a better source than Iowa State University.
If there is, it isn’t Wikipedia.
Back on topic, thank you for the viewing and reading suggestions regarding permaculture. I probably won’t go read those books, but I may watch the video if I get time. It is still a good topic for a future show. I can appreciate your candor that Bill Mollison can explain it better than you, but I’m sure it would still be enlightening to hear your take.
I tend to agree with Marauder that there cannot possibly be just one answer to the problem of world hunger. If there is, permaculture isn’t it.
@Pete again you show your ignorance.
“I tend to agree with Marauder that there cannot possibly be just one answer to the problem of world hunger. If there is, permaculture isn’t it.”
Again there is nothing singular about Permaculture.
As far as wiki goes I am sorry but just because you don’t like the answer doesn’t make it wrong. I also have very little respect for ANY AG Information from any university as currently they are ALL bought and paid for by the Monsantos of the world.
Permaculture would have to be considered an agricultural technique within the context of this conversation. Or, if you prefer, we could call it a “methodology.” That isn’t relevant, within the context of your contention, that permaculture could “solve the problem.” That problem being world food shortages.
I’ve made my living in the food business, on the retail end, for almost a decade–first as a chef, then as an owner. Nobody has a higher appreciation for quality ingredients, supporting family farmers and the evils of corporate food production than I do. I was shopping with CSAs, for my restaurant kitchens, before most on this board even knew what the initials meant.
I agree that many, if not most, of Monsanto’s practices are “evil.” However, if we do away with them tomorrow, people will starve. That is indisputable. Permaculture, organic and bio-dynamic methodology, while admirable, doesn’t stop that.
@marauder, you said.
“Permaculture would have to be considered an agricultural technique within the context of this conversation.”
See again that is the problem it would be more accurate to say, Permaculture would have to be considered a massive group of agricultural techniques within the context of this conversation. It is not “a solution” but a collection of methods, yes a methodology but even if we limit it to a methodology of growing it is so massive in size, scope, technique and adaptation only the uninformed would refer to it in the singular. To say “permaculture” isn’t the solution to hunger makes about as much sense as saying “agriculture” isn’t the solution.
You also said, “I agree that many, if not most, of Monsanto’s practices are “evil.” However, if we do away with them tomorrow, people will starve. That is indisputable.”
Well I never said we should halt all monoculture techniques over night. We should though at minimum allow people to label items as GMO free and let that free market Peter claims to support start the process of elimination of this scourge to humanity.
Lastly if we stay on this path it is only a matter time before a lot of people die a lot more then getting off GMOs would kill. The current monoculture practices destroy soil and there will be a limit to what GMOs can do about that even if we get the best possible results from such tampering with the biology of our food at the DNA level.
People need to understand the level of soil loss, the level of aquifer depletion, the level of land that is being salted, the level of land being turned into desert and many other problems beyond GMOs in and of themselves.
Buy no instead we worry about CO2 while the very soil we depend on is turned into sterile and salted dust and think that science can save us from such destruction.
Hi Jack,
My opinion on the issue is a matter of record now, as is your own, so there’s not much more to add at this point.
If you mention this on your show–and I hope that you will–please direct the rest of your listeners to the comments section for this show. I’m sure you have enough respect for your listeners to allow them the courtesy of reading the transcript and drawing their own conclusions.
jack–you’re getting hung up on the notion that permaculture is not a singular methodology. Nobody is disputing that an optimal permaculture system, has multiple systems and perhaps thousands of techniques. We get that. The bigger picture question, is your contention that permaculture could, not only keep up with modern multi-national ag, but outpace it. As it would have to outpace it substantially, if it were to feed the world.
If the stats I found are correct, the US alone, would need to have close to 1.5mil acres under permaculture cultivation, to provide the fruit and vegetable needs of it\’s population. That doesn\’t address the fact that certain zones will not be able to produce enough variety to keep people satisfied in the off season weeks. How do we address protein production? What do they eat? There is no debating that these systems can be thought out and probably work on a micro scale. However, it starts to run away quickly when you get into the hundreds of millions. Let\’s jump to China or India. How many acres to feed 1.3bil Chinese? Or 1bil Indians? How many people starve if the crop doesn\’t come in that year for whatever reason?
jack,
Perhaps in the back and forth, you lost track of the comments. You were adamant to Peter, that permaculture is the solution to the problem. You said that. As such, the onus is on you to cite literature that can hope to substantiate that claim. I’m not a fan of traditional agriculture. I think much of Monsanto’s practices need to be reigned in. However, I didn’t say that they could feed the world or even that they are nice people. On the other hand, you said permaculture could. It can’t.
And it’s not necessary to frame a debate with \"ignorant\" or "uniformed.\" One could say that an such an expert in things, would know the proper rules for punctuating quotation marks–everything inside the quotes Jack–or that the word you want to use in your show explanation at the top of this page is \"affect\" not \"effect.\" Things \"affect\" us…on the other hand, people can \"effect\" change on things. Or if you prefer, your bug out bag is full of your personal effects. However, you calling me uninformed, had no affect on me.
ignorant – lacking knowledge or information as to a particular subject or fact.
Ignorant is not an insult sorry you took it that way.
As for the onus being on me to prove that Permaculture is the solution I gave you the resources that do that. The video series I mention covers all growing conditions.
My next resource for you, go google, “greening the desert” and look was was done only a few miles from the Dead Sea on salted earth.
If a person chooses to remain ignorant I can’t help them.
The last attack online when all else is lost, is always to attack the grammar of your opponent.
I’ve listened to your show since episode 50 or show–before you even knew what permaculture was. I’d like to think we learned about it together.
I’ve read the books you listed. I didn’t approach the free flowing form of this comments section, as a final exam. Within the context that I entered the conversation, the definition of permaculture wasn’t necessary. In my follow up post, I suggested that I was aware that permaculture is a multi system methodology, with hundreds, if not thousands of techniques.
I’m glad that you are also an expert on behavior on the internet. I never viewed you as an “opponent.” It seems reasonable to me, that if somebody is going to call me ignorant, they should have a grammar school level grasp of grammar and spelling. An incidental mistake, here or there, is being nit picky. If you are going to portray yourself as an expert on subject matter, in a written medium, you should know the rules of grammar.
Lastly, if I wanted to be a real douche, I would rewrite your last comment to me. Inserting all the commas you missed.
Getting kind of petty ~ bloggers welcome dissenting opinions as long as the debate remains civil and respectful. Most of us aren’t sitting here with our Gregg Reference Manual in hand to see if the authors get effect/affect right. I appreciate the info and viewpoints that have been presented from all in this debate, but that kind of stuff… well……
Thanks for a great show.
Jack, don’t feed the trolls.
marauder,
Good thing you didn’t take the time to add commas to Jack’s comments because you misused commas 3 times in your last comment.
ROFLAO
@ Peter, marauder, I didn\’t know we were trying to solve world hunger now! No pressure or nothin\’ Jack!
The train wreck we are headed toward is directly related to the fact that humans have overshot the planet\’s carrying capacity. The late so-called \"father of the green revolution\" Norman Borlaug knew that he was only buying us time to find ways to deal with the population problem. Unfortunately we have wasted that time.
So we can make pointless arguments in favor of MORE energy intensive, MORE biologically destructive methods of farming. Designed to once again increase yield IN THE SHORT TERM…
Or we can recognize the writing on the wall for what it is, and make preparations to care for our loved ones.
@marauder
I have NEVER claimed to be an expert writer and your last comment made you come off well, you said it yourself.
I do hope we learned together because you are right at one time I was ignorant to permaculture too. I still don’t think you get it based on your claims. Finally if you have indeed listened since the 50th episode you know very well I have made the point that we can’t just switch overnight myself.
Finally, I think Peter is an assclown and I think at least some of my feelings toward him got directed toward you. For that I apologize. I don’t agree with you on some of these points but I don’t think your are an assclown nor do I think you are lacking in intelligence.
Oh and one more thing I have never claimed to be an expert about permaculture either but I don’t need to know where a fricken comma goes to be very proficient as a permaculturist. I am not a great writer, why do you think I do a podcast vs. a conventional blog?
I am just a dumb ass redneck coal miner’s son with a measured IQ of 168 who can’t spell very well because leaning what to do was always more important to me then learning how to write about it. ;>)
Jack,
Fair enough. I also apologize if I came off too sensitive.
Jack,
Just for clarification, it’s called Xeriscape not Zeroscape. I write this not to bash or anything like that. I just want people to know the correct spelling so they can better research this lanscaping style.
I also remember a news story in Metro-Detroit back in 1994 where another family was fined for putting in a Xeriscape landscape around their house. (The family had moved there from Colorado and was the first to import this lanscape style.) His neighbor complained about it saying “I don’t live in the suburbs to live next door to a forest!” (paraphrase from memory)
Unfortunately the count sided with the angry neighbor and forced the Colorado family to redo their lanscape to “more normal” asthetics.
@Gene thanks I am on a live interview right now. Will sort that out later,
Jack
Hi Jack,
It’s unfortunate that expressing a view contrary to your own results in me being labeled a “troll” or “assclown.” People can read the transcript and judge for themselves, but I think it’s clear that I tried to present my opinion in a relatively cordial and respectful manner. We disagree, and not even 180 degrees.
Two free-thinking individuals can have different opinions on a complex topic, as is the case here. If you want to shout me down or shut down the conversation by calling me assclown (the ultimate SurvivalPodcast.com diss), that’s your prerogative. It’s your website, not mine.
I’ve been a loyal listener of yours (not every episode, but most) since very early on–around episode 80 or so. I’ve used your tips to grow my first ever patio container garden. I’ve even copied an episode of your podcast to CD to distribute to several friends and family that wouldn’t have otherwise given it a try.
I don’t say this to illicit sympathy, but just to say this: that when you call someone an assclown for disagreeing with you–and justify it however you want, but that’s what you did–you can and will lose your listeners. Maybe (probably) you don’t care.
@Pete… Your acting/sounding just like a Mon-SAUN-toe talking head…GMO IS BAD… beginning middle and end… It is poison…Literally they “Mad scientist” BUG KILLER in to the food… are you going to tell me that is safe for you and me. Yeah you probably will. CORN is in everything. High Frictos Corn Syrup is in everything…. We are eating enormous amounts of this crap all day every day and most of the population dosnt even realize how much of that wounderous corn we ingest every day. Its poising us! Pigs fed this GMO corn lost there ability to reproduce. Infertility in this country (which is one of the few that allows this corn to be grown) is rising every day. Women who come from families with there mother and grandmother had 5 and 12 children, give birth to one child, inspite of the fact that they want 6…
I can go on and on about how the GMO foods are damaging our bodies and the bodies of our CHILDREN… But you go right on singing the praises of GMO and hope that GMO dosnt give you cancer or gives cancer to one of your loved ones.
Further more Permaculture is the only sustainable way to feed this planet… actualy watch the multi part documentary on how and why Permaculture can be created anywhere and what it can do that Jack is telling you about…
And yeah I cant spell nor do I know anything about Grammar… the Public California Edu System served me well… So dont even go there!
GMO IS Killing us and your singing its praises…
Jack have you ever heard about these guys ? http://www.gmfreeschools.org/GMFree/Home/index.cfm
MDH and I watched some of there videos last night and OMG… I knew GMO were bad but damn…. now Im mad… and Pete… was my boiling point after watching that…We love ya Jack! Keep it up!
Hi Kathlyn,
Sorry I got you worked up. If you go back and read what I said, I think you’ll see that I’m not saying GMOs aren’t “bad.” (Please see post #8) I readily acknowledge the recent research showing that GMOs have been shown to have an adverse effect on the health of mice. As you point out, that applies to other animals in some cases as well.
My point is that, to the extend GMOs are evil, they are a necessary evil. I hope that further research will lead to healthier, higher yielding and more nutrative foods. There are a lot of mouths to feed, and GMOs are an essential part (but not the only part) of the solution.
Jack and I disagree on this. But it is a complex issue, and two free-thinking people can reasonably have different opinions. I think the survival community should encourage free-thinking in all issues. One day, the ability to think for ourselves may keep us alive.
It is unfortunate that my different opinion in this one area has apparently made me a pariah here. Especially when I agree with Jack on 95% of the rest of the issues TSP covers day-to-day.
Finally, for the record, NOT ONCE did I criticize anyone else’s spelling or grammar. I’ve done my best to keep the discussion non personal, civilized and on point. An argument “won” by bullying doesn’t count for much where I was brought up.
@Peter, I don’t have a problem with your views, but when you start your first message with:
“This is nit-picky, so apologies in advance…” you HAVE to know that you are truly being a) nit-picky (just as you said) and b)antagonistic.
I actually appreciate the contrasting info so I can make informed decisions, but when you start out that way, it looks like you’ve just come to pick a fight.
I hope you continue to contribute, just bring a better attitude.. and that doesn’t mean wrapping your insults in pre-cursor apologies. Grammar (and punctuation) corrections are only appreciated on high school science papers, not blogs.. and if you just can’t help yourself and feel that a spelling or pronunciation error actually detracts from the material, send a private message so that Jack can correct it.
GMO has never been about producing more food–it is about selling more chemicals.
Great show Jack. As for the OC story. Imagine if the Dervais family had to deal with city because of their endeavors.. hmm.
BTW I saw a tad about how even Whole Foods is coming under controversy now for buying from China.
For those of you content on eating GMO food than I have a few boxes of Soylent green wafers for ya.. I refer not too. GMO is not a necesary evil. We have plenty of land on which to grow healthy nutritious foods sans pesticides and crap.. If we would only use it wisely.
I’m a simple person. When trying to sort through complex ideas, ideas that are far bigger than me as an individual, I often use analogy or parallel relationship.
GMO as a necessary evil. First I would question, “Is evil necessary?” “Is anything I would classified as evil that path I really want to choose. Is the “lesser of two evils” still evil?
We agree with the evilness of GMO, whether a mild evil or great evil.
Enlarged: GMO as a necessary evil to combat world hunger. Analogy: Mass homicide as a necessary evil to combat world hunger. Mass homicide of the world population is both evil and might solve the problem, similar to GMO. To my mind, at least, it is quite clear that one does not use an “evil” means to solve a problem. Garbage in= garbage out!
Worse than what’s happening to the frogs, around a lot of rural communities in Wisconsin there are high concentrations of atrazine found in the municipal water supply.
Back to the frogs, some can do that already without exposure to atrazine. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1200/is_n9_v137/ai_8784789/
Anyway, thanks for another great show Jack.
Peter:
Since post world war II global corporations and government have tried industrial ag. methods that simplify crop diversity and promote monoculture production of few crops via massive inputs. This “Green Revolution” increased yields for a few years to a decade depending on what study you believe. Either way it didn’t take long for topsoil losses to pile up, resistance by pests to pesticides to increase, as well as the loss of nutrient density in the crops being produced (because plants can only pass on the goodness that’s in the soil they grow in), health of the export countries declined accordingly, and many many other costs from biodiversity loss in neighboring ecosystems to health states going downhill in first world importer countries eating more and more of less and less nutrient dense and diverse foods.
We’ve tried simplifying agriculture systems – that’s what industrial agribusiness has done for 50 years solid now. GMO’s are the latest move in this same direction. We already know this doesn’t work, it’s decreasing yields not increasing them because it mines soil, doesn’t build it. This is a dead end road my friend and if you can’t see that already go to these export countries where this colonial agriculture has been instituted. Saying we need GMO’s to feed the world’s hungry is ignoring the root of the problem – quite literally – and adding insult to injury by basically saying we need to industrialize agriculture even more. That’s heading faster down a dead end road. Permaculture has not been tried like agribusiness – its’ received a fraction of the funding because no one makes enormous profits from sufficient farmers being empowered all over the globe, just the reverse.
Gotta reply again:
“Permaculture can’t feed the world.”
How can people say this? If they mean by permaculture – an intensive form of managing high biodiversity cropping systems with a focus on building biological health in those systems (like soil) and producing fertility on site, not shipping in from off site, than I have to ask: Are you for real? We haven’t tried that. Just the opposite – we’ve moved in the opposite direction from permaculture/agricultural ecosystems for the last half century++. And we have more soil loss than ever before, more people starving than ever before (proportionally) and more threadbare ecosystems than ever before. These are not disputed facts. And this is the direct result of industrial agriculture which transgenic seeds are one extreme version of. Do you grow food and work with soil Peter? Do you have an appreciate of the complexity of living systems and how easy it is to damage them by simplifying them? Have you seen how pests attack stressed plants in your garden? Do you understand how natural systems function? You should before you make big claims about huge decisions to change the fundamental nature of evolution and crop-adaption which moving genes from one kingdom to another does, in an unprecedented way. E.g. a gene from a silkworm being moved into a sheep, or a gene from an animal being moved into a plant.
Can you say BAD IDEA?
Jack clearly states – One man’s opinion of a changing world and changing times. Take that literally folks.
All the clowns that try to nit-pick his comments, ideas, grammar and punctuation to death are either grossly insecure or bored. Likely both.
168? I call shenanigans!
@Albert, nope its all true. Got the paper work to prove it as though it would even really matter.
Kathy,
My concern with Jack’s mispronunciation of Monsanto was that he works in the medium of audio. Were a new listener to stumble onto his podcast, or were he to be interviewed on a larger format, I would not want anyone to be immediately dismissive of his views on account of his failure to properly pronounce the subject of his commentary. Jack informed me that the mispronunciation was deliberate, and so I happily dropped it. If he knows he’s saying it wrong and wants to say it wrong as a dig against Monsanto, that’s his business. I never said anything about his or anyone else’s spelling or grammar. I was trying to be helpful to Jack, since I do hope he’s taken seriously, even if I disagree with him on this topic.
Ben,
Thank you for your well-written and thoughtful reply. I enjoyed reading it, and I think you make some very good points.
Albert,
Thanks for calling shenanigans!
@Peter,
If anyone dismisses anything I say over how I say Monsanto I absolutely guarantee you I don’t want them listening to me anyway.
Now as far as the “shenanigans” go think what you want bud. However, you’re the one that thinks a patent on a life form that harms the property of your competition is an example of the “free market” at work. ;>)
Jack,
Regarding atrazine, I just wanted to pass on that it is a restricted product that cannot be picked up in a hardware store or somewhere like that for home use…users must be licensed. Also, it is highly regulated regarding how much can be used each year…farmers and ag retailers (yes, I work for an ag retailer) are subject to periodic inspections and audits (both of which happen on a regular basis) to make sure that we are following these guidelines. One other thing regarding atrazine; watersheds are monitored for atrazine levels. We have a local watershed that just came under scrutiny for exceeding that. In the course of checking this out I found a map source that shows where the water that runs behind my home originates. As a matter of preparation it might not be a bad idea for folks to know where their water comes from in case of something like this (chem contamination), bio-terrorism, etc… In MO, you can find this info at http://www.cares.missouri.edu. I’m not sure about other states. Thanks Jack.