Episode-1344- Listener Calls for 5-9-14 — 49 Comments

  1. I have Lawton’s online PDC and I want the PermaEthos PDC as well. I also want the plant propagation and beekeeping, all of this is lining up with how I’ve been thinking about moving my future. Keep ’em coming Jack, I like the direction this is heading.

  2. Jack, thanks for the section on chicken processing. Very helpful. What do you think about boiling the remaining carcass, sans skin and just giving back to your live chickens? Ive found that they go crazy for all meat, even chicken meat. They pick it clean. Have you heard of any downsides to this? Thanks for any input.


    • Well the official answer is don’t do it, the truth is, it likely won’t hurt a thing, especially if you boil it fully. Yes chickens eat chicken, they go nuts for it.

      • I imagine they really wouldn’t eat anything that wasn’t good for them anyway if they have plenty of options to choose from. Im a pro at cleaning bones clean, but these buggers leave nothing, not even tendons/soft tissue.

  3. Jack,

    On the fuel tax the revenue officers in most states go around checking, I know they do in Texas. A common tactic is to target lots of places where farmers or contractors who have access to off-road diesel gather, like stockyards. They run a wand down in the tank to see if it comes out with traces of red dye or something else while going around the parking lot looking for diesel trucks.

    It is also sometimes the IRS directly doing it, and they get stupid about it.

    So a locking gas cap is a good investment if you plan to run on road. I keep most of mine for my diesel generators and tractors because the hassle of greeting a fuel blenders license and the paperwork isn’t worth it.

    For canvas two products have worked well for me. The first is called Canvak and is sold commercially. But I was told by a canvas tarp manufacturer years ago that clear Thompsons Water Seal was great for canvas and when I tried it, he was right. On a light colored canvas it will darken it, but it works and the prices is right. Just make sure you have a few days to let it air out before packing it away to let the smell dissipate. I have used it for over a decade now with great luck..

    • Oh I know on the Red Dye I mean how would they know you made your own fuel with oil.

    • Oh and Thompsons is basically a wax so it makes sense it would work very well. Good tip and it is pretty cheap comparatively.

    • Is that not a complete violation of the 4th amendment? (not that anyone cares….)

  4. The main difference between the Eagles and the Maple Leaf’s is that the Maple Leaf is .9999 vs .999 for the Eagle. I don’t think that makes any difference in the end anyway.

  5. It appears is no longer up and running these days…

    • I emailed Neil he is likely having a heart attack about it and beating the heck out of someone in IT or Marketing as we speak. LOL. God I am glad that is no longer my problem. When a site is down you are NOT HAPPY. Very not happy.

  6. Hey jack, with your thoughts on running a PermaEthos store, would you tie this in with AgriTrue? Might be a good way to cross promote the two properties.

    • Agreed. It seems like you’d be competing with yourself and diluting the marketplace a bit.

  7. Jack you can ask Marjory Wildcraft how to become a guest on Coast to Coast she has been on a few times and she mentioned your name and podcast, unfortunately she was always on with John B. Wells a fellow Texan and Prepper and he’s no longer a host, George is a Prepper as well so you never know, being on with George brought Alex Jones from 100k listeners to where he is now, Art Bell would never have Alex on the show but when George took over so many people emailed him and called in asking to have Alex on that he became a regular on the show

    • From the Coast to Coast Website:

      “Have you ever wondered how to become a guest on Coast to Coast AM? It’s easy. Just send an e-mail to the Producer stating your name, phone number, the area of your expertise or the nature of your experience. If it sounds like something worth talking about on Coast to Coast AM, the producer will call you. It’s that easy. Write to:

      You can also email the Hosts emails as well. They used to say that on the air.
      When Ian was on I used to recommend Jack every couple of months.
      They have had James Wesley Rawles, Cody Lundin, Marjory Wildcraft and a couple of other Preppers on in the past, it’s something they do every few months.

      • Hi Jack.

        First off, LI Country Boy is correct. Just fill out their guest survey (just like your TSP guest survey). And mentioning your podcast and the huge following you have will easily put you on the short list.

        Second, your name has been mentioned with a very positive regard on Coast to Coast AM more than once. You have been named by name –and your podcast has been named– by guests and call-in listeners alike. All mentions of you and TSP have been positive. There is a desire by MANY people to hear you on C2C.

        Here’s a link to a forum post I made something like a year or more ago where I told everyone here about how you had once again been named by name by a guest of C2C. The guest was Brad Barker, a survivalist expert, and the date of that radio broadcast was March 2, 2013.

        The host that evening was John B. Wells (he is no longer at C2C) and during the interview, John B. Wells became very interested in asking more about who you were, and he even asked his guest how your name was spelled.

        Here’s a slice of what was said about you:

        BRAD: The other one was The Survival Podcast. You just go to The Survival Podcast dot com. Jack Spirko is the host there. Again, this is a guy I don’t know, He’s just a guy I listen to. Because the moment you think you know everything is the day you stop learning, and that’s the day you just increased your own vulnerability. So we [at HALO] are always listening to what other people in this space are doing because we are both teachers and students, and that’s a real healthy place for us.

        JOHN B. : How are we spelling his last name? s-p-i-r-c-o?

        BRAD: s-p-i-r-K-o. Jack Spirko, and that’s The Survival Podcast dot com.

        JOHN B. : All right. Very good. Well, thanks for that!

        At the end of that forum post, I urged you to go ahead and fill out their guest survey form to apply for being a guest on C2C.

    • The thought of Jack Spirko talking to George Noory just makes me sad. The original Coast-to-Coast was a thing of beauty, and very TSP-ish. Art Bell built it from nothing in a double-wide trailer in the high desert, running his own board, screening his own calls, gaining a national audience in the millions but never sacrificing his independence. Then along came Noory—a non-genius, whatever you think of him—who promptly turned the show into a edge-less corporate snoozefest. I can see the logic of using it as a platform for more exposure, but ugh.

      • I dont blame the host. The network and the uppers in management that really have destroyed the show. Or whats left of it. I stopped listening shortly after Art Bell left. Down hill ever since then.

  8. Jack,
    If you get a good rain today make sure to get some video of the swails.

  9. Jack just saw a commercial for Startup New York, where they are offering small businesses up to 10 years state tax free for moving there, i didn’t catch it all and the site was down when I tried it, but, it looks like you nailed it again!

  10. some of my best moments have been myself with a couple buddies on our inflatable pontoon boats floating rivers chasing the elusive steelhead chrome!

  11. What is the non too feed you are feeding the chickens Jack, I would like to check into it for comparison with others I have found.

  12. Morning Jack
    SO Perma ethos 🙂
    How can us Canadians get involved ?
    We are based in Cape Breton NS, been living off grid for over 4 years, Moved from Toronto etc ( Tough winter just passed but still here lol)
    We run survival and the wife runs retreat classes.
    We have lots of farm friends here in the Island and would love to get involved with your Perma ethos but based in Canada etc
    drop us a line when you get a chance,
    Best thoughts for the wofe as well 🙂

    All the best Paul and Anne Cobham

    • Well since there are no “investor relationships” involved there really isn’t a big problem. You can certainly take our courses. Can you sell under the Ethos Brand, I don’t know how that works it is a question for our lawyer I guess. Are we going to build a on site Ethos Farm in Canada? Perhaps but again even a second farm in the US is a ways off. On shipping goods and plants between the US and Canada, that is based on what the two governments require.

  13. Jack I really liked your take on Bow Hunting. You’re right when you said people would be able to think clearer if they did some bow hunting. I love sitting in my stand for hours and becoming one with the forest. BTW I live in Ohio on the PA border. When I’m out there I feel like I’m going back to my roots and I firmly believe that hunting with a bow is hard coded into our DNA. The further away we get from that the more we become depressed as a society. I believe if you take a person that takes meds for depression and got them bow hunting they would find that they don’t need the pills anymore. Modern city society seems to be draining people souls. People are not meant to sit in an office for 8 or 10 hours a day only to go home and sit on a couch, watch TV, and eat processed foods. I have an office job but when I get home I work around the homestead taking care of the chickens, tending to the raised beds, and taking my kids fishing. Getting outside and doing things our ancestors did can heal a lot of ailments. Also I have a question for you Jack, would you plant Imperial Whitetail clover for your deer to graze on? I can’t find if it’s GMO or not. What are your thoughts on food plots?

    • Food plots are fine as long as “the man” doesn’t have a problem with it and he does in some states. Imperial seems to be a proprietary variety of clover. Higher protein, yadda, yadda. No I would likely not plant it though I doubt it is GMO. Not enough money in it for that.

      I would plant a mix of clovers, Dutch White, New Zealand White, Rose, Crimson, etc. Though in some alfalfa for kicks, perhaps some medics (san salva is great), some daikon and turnips to help with soil structure. Add in chicory and plantain for diversity of perennials. Why buy something just because they put a picture of a deer on it? The above will last for generations and get better every year and be not just good for deer but a good pasture. Leave the native grasses come in too. Everything except the daikon and turnips are perennial. Those two just toss a pound out each fall and spring, soon in your climate they will be self reseeding.

      • Thank Jack. The man does not have a problem with food plots in Ohio….yet. The man in Ohio does have a problem with using rifles for hunting deer in Ohio…drives me nuts. Anyways last year we planted oats, turnips, and alfalfa. So thanks for the suggestions and I’ll be adding some plants that you suggested. The property that we hunt is almost 40 acres and we have put a lot of work into it and it’s quite beautiful. I really want to take a permaculture approach with this land and I think it could produce a bigger and healthier herd.

      • I have grown to have a problem with the recommendations that these food plot companies give out. Most if not all recommend spraying the field with roundup, tilling, cultipacking the see, laying down heavy lime and fertilizer, and spraying other herbicides as the plants get larger. I think this an issue that needs to be addressed, because in all reality it is conventional farming for deer.

  14. Jack,

    You hit it on the head with comfrey. Comfrey is also know as bruisewort. Growing up, my grandfather would take a couple of handfulls of dried comfrey root and toss it in a half gallon jar. He would then throw in a couple fifths of everclear, seal it and let it set for about 8 weeks. He kept 3 of these in rotation. Every time any of us got a bruise or contusion, he would soak down a rag from an old tshirt with some of this and make us leave it on for a couple hours. Takes the pain out really quick and makes the bruise heal much faster. I still use it. There are very good herbal resources out there, as well as licensed herbalists in most areas who give classes as well.

    • Herbalists are certified, which is voluntary, not licensed. I honestly hope that never changes, as there’s nothing in a license that actually provides any more safety to the public.

      Comfrey tincture for external use, and comfrey leaf in a poultice is wonderful. I keep comfrey leaf poultices (thickened with lavender powder) in my freezer just in case of an injury. Comfrey tea, short term, I don’t have an issue with it. I just wouldn’t recommend it to someone with existing liver issues.

  15. Jack!
    This is John from TN/NY who was indeed the guy who stepped up to the plate with the audio video issues at Permaculture voices! (I got the job for next year because of it, YAY!!)
    Thank you for answering the question so thoroughly! You may or may not have touched on a question behind the question that was in my phone call.

    Now I know I snuck in multiple questions there, but you didn’t really talk about the leftover wash!!! What are your thoughts about what to do with the left over wash? Animal feed? Compost? direct application to a garden bed?


    • Ignoring the GMO thing for the answer I always feed spent grains to my birds, they love it. I don’t use corn so for now GMO is a non concern for me. I’d likely even feed GMO corn mash to the birds if it wasn’t frequent and if they were not being raised for market but I would not do it frequently. Again though for now there are no forms of GMO wheat or barley or rye.

      • Here are my thoughts that I perhaps should have included in my already long winded question. The cheapest to free sugar and starch sources for the mash that will be fermented and eventually put in the still are usually gmo or full of toxic gick. Old pastries/cookies still have tons of soy, canola and corn product. So I was more worried about that kind of stuff for medicinal utilization of the ethanol. Also, what about the leftover mash in that situation?? Pigs? Compost? Don’t worry about it at all and just feed it to them??

    • JP;
      The only thing I’d add to Jacks responses, is when distilling to purify a substance the question you have to ask is “what is the boiling point of the substance you wish to eliminate?” If the boiling point of the gick is lower than that of alcohol then it gets distilled first and unless you dump the first bit of distillate (heads) it will end up in your finished product. If the gick has a boiling point higher than that of alcohol it might end up in your tails at the end of the alcohol distilation, and after multiple distillations the majority of it should be eliminated. Worst case is the gick has the same boiling point as alcohol or so close as to be indistinguishable by the novice. if the boiling point is the same (unlikely) or lower than alcohol if you don’t eliminate the heads (dump the first bit of distillate) then you may actually be concentrating the amount of gick in your medicine.
      I hope that made sense.

      • Makes total sense. Thank you! One of the gick byproducts is methanol and I was trying to see how to eliminate that. What you said makes sense with everything I learned while trying to get rid of the methanol.

        • Let me add though.

          1. If the shit hits the fan, you won’t be getting that stuff, period. So your couched question doesn’t work. There will be no free throw away cakes and breads in that world.

          2. In the here and now there is no reason to use soy product if you wanted “medicinal” alcohol. Plenty of shops will give you plain old bread which is pound for pound identical to sugar. It generally is made with wheat not soy, it may have a tiny bit of corn sugar but very little.

          3. If you are making um, “medicinal” alcohol now, don’t use that shit at all. One 50 pound sack of barley or wheat combined one 50 pound sack of cane sugar will make a lot of um, medicine. A LOT! If you can get non gmo feed corn I would use that though, corn whiskey is good stuff. It isn’t likely hard to find some non GMO feed corn if you look for it.

          Another free or very cheap source is something high in sugar that goes bad fast from the produce section. Say bananas! Talk to a few grocers see if they will give you the bad bananas say they are for your livestock and composting. Shiners call it banana brandy but almost none of the banana comes though. Especially if triple run and then diluted down to 80-100 proof with distilled water.

  16. I thought Jack’s response about egg eating was spot on and I want to add just a little. First, we have used scrap carpet squares to cushion the bottoms of wooden nest boxes with good success. The birds can’t scratch out the stiff square.

    Also, we run a few hundred layers. For whatever reason they tend to favor certain nest boxes over others. When there are a dozen or more eggs in one hole you are going to see breakage…either from a new egg falling on the pile or from two hens fighting for the nest space and stepping on an egg. We do two things to limit breakage when the flock is laying heavily. We collect eggs twice in the morning and we make certain that there is a source of calcium in front of the flock at all times. Oyster shell is cheap.

    As a final thought, John Pugliano’s advice was spot on. I have time in surplus…and should be looking to sell that surplus to multiple customers (employers).

  17. I can attest to John’s advice on prepping for one’s next job. I have been successful in my field and continue to work in a national sales organization where the jobs are prized and insecure at the field sales level. I was asked to sit in on some interviews for an open position in my area. Wow, I discovered how unprepared I was should something happen to my current role. It would take some time to get caught up with other candidates if one waited for the axe to fall. Thanks for the reminder John.

  18. Broken egg eating: Besides the nutritional benefit the chickens get from eating broken eggs, it also keeps the nest area clean. Less chance for predators to find the nest if there are no smelly, rotting eggs in it. Same idea when my dogs whelp a litter. Mama Dog eats the placenta which is nutritious and, if she were whelping in the wild, the whelping area would be clean.

  19. Can’t resist linking to my video of Speedy’s cousin who I met in early May on my 2.5 acres of California high desert. This is a very pretty Red Racer Snake (video is HD if selected):

  20. As far as peaceful places. Jack, did you ever visit Devils den state park in Arkansas? My wife and I went there once and really enjoyed our time. The cave “Devil’s Den” is easy to go into and a fun experience.

  21. It’s been sooo long since I’ve heard from John in WV. I was going to call in and leave my best John impression to have him call in.

    Nice show!

  22. Chicken and duck eggs have different proteins. Quail eggs would have another kind of protein. While I agree some may be allergic to the soy, corn, or other ingredients in feed it is not uncommon for people to be allergic to a protein in any type of egg. I am on a bunch of forums for people with food issues and many have tried buying hens and then growing their own special feeds only to find out that they are indeed allergic/intolerant to the protein. This was our families case. Who knows why all these food issues seem to be so prevalent but I didn’t want to dissuade anyone from trying duck, quail, goose, or any other kind of egg if they can’t have chicken egg protein. Love the show!!!

  23. RE: Peaceful places–One place I’ve always liked is the desert southwest, especially at twilight after the sun has dipped below the horizon. If you sit somewhere you can get the same effect you mentioned in the northeast woods–eventually you see animals going about their business, more or less ignoring you. Even in the summer when it’s extremely hot, it’s pleasant once there’s no sun.

    • Except on evenings like today! It’s howlin’ like a banshee out there and dirt is flying everywhere! 🙂

  24. Jack, your last piece on poultry processing was so detailed and thorough, it might be useful to post a video demonstrating the process. Or perhaps you’ve already done that. If so, could you kindly post the link. Thx!