Episode-1444- A Tuesday Chat with Jack — 49 Comments

  1. Hey Jack,
    Maybe you can do another deer hunting show. I just got my bow liscense and didnt realize how much I have to freaking learn like what kind of treestand you recommend where i should put it different broadheads what you bring in the woods with you?

    Just a thought Thanks man…

  2. My wife and I were fortunate enough to attend the first PermaEthos Fall festival. We drove back and forth from Connecticut, camped in the back of our pick up, endured rain and mud but had a great time! We learned a lot, did things we never thought we’d do (processing chicken!?) and best of all met a great bunch of like minded folks who are also traveling the road to personal freedom. I would highly recommend anyone considering an event to go.
    Thanks again to everyone who made this event possible especially Charlie, Kevin, Josiah, Jessie, Nick, Jack and their families.
    P.S. Jack, my wife is especially proud of what she now calls her “three beer knife” 😉

  3. Stuck in airport limbo? A likely story. The fact that Jack didn’t produce a show yesterday (Columbus Day), a day in which most government employees don’t work, is proof positive that he is a paid shill of the NSA.

    Just kidding. Glad your back 🙂

    • Just wanted to reply directly in case you didn’t read my comment below. I’m in green bay, lots of family in crivitz. Myself and another very local listener are extremely active on Zello and I would like to invite you to try it out. I’m trucker Nate on Zello as well. If there is in fact a meet up on Sunday, a coworker and I are planning to attend, so the possibility of a three person ride share exists.

  4. Jack,

    Yesterday I went to my first parent teacher meeting for my 1st grade kid. In such meeting, we discussed reading, writing and math. The reading and writing parts were tolerable, but then we got to math. Word problems are now called number sentences. Instead of teaching the mechanics of addition and subtraction first and then introducing word problems to test the application of the mechanics, the school system decided to teach math with word sentences first. Now, these word problems follow a 3 sentence format where in the first line a number is introduced. Then, on the second line a second number, followed by a question regarding the two number on the third line. In addition, kids are being taught to associate the plus or minus operand with key words like take or give or eat, etc… They even have a list of plus and minus words that will be on the test. To further complicate the matter, once the kid extracts the relevant numbers and what he is supposed to do with them (add or subtract) from the verbiage, he now has to show his work.

    Jack had 8 apples.
    Sally gave Jack 7 apples.
    How many apples does Jack have?

    Any kid from our generation would written 15 and moved on. But no, under the new and improved math program, the kid has to turn the problem into a “friendly” problem. So he has to solve like this: 7-2 = 5 and 8 +2 = 10, so 10 + 5 = 15. Why? Because 10 is a “friendly” number and they have memorized that 10 + 5 is 15.

    Amazed, and my blood boiling inside, I asked the teacher is they were teaching common core. Her answers was a proud and resounding, “Absolutely.” I flat our told her that they were holding back students with this method, but her retort was some BS about students comprehending base 10 numbers easier than odd number blah, blah, blah….

    She also told us that we needed to practice the three number sentence format since that’s how the kid will be assessed in the state standardized test.

    Oh! And to close, she reassured us that our kid is a good student: she raises her hand, follows commands, and is always eager to learn. Fuck!

    I’ve had my gut turned since yesterday thinking about that freaking meeting and the disservice that the school, but most importantly myself, is doing to my kid.

    • They seem to be teaching “speed math.”

      If you recall the movie “Matilda” a little girl is self taught. The teacher has finished a math lesson and her class is able to multiple numbers up to 12 x 12. Then the teacher (Miss Honey) suddenly suggests that one day they will be able to multiple very large numbers and throws out a couple of random numbers that would cause any of us to work it out on a piece of paper but Matilda is able to do the math in her head using “speed mathematics”.

      There are a number of systems the school might be using but the one I am familiar with is the “Trachtenberg System”. See the link below for a summary. I have the book around here somewhere. I was never very proficient at it but I recognize its value in specific cases.

      I’m not sure how valuable it will be for the general student body. I think a few kids will pick it up and do well… but those kids would do well if you hung a grindstone around their necks and shot out both their legs. The average student will be more confused than ever. The poor student will just give up entirely.

      Of course the real problem is that the student loses the help of the parents, yet the school complains that the parents don’t get involved in the student’s homework. Duh.

    • I’ve heard of those speed math methods. My dad knows a bunch of tricks to multiply big numbers. I never cared much for them. I seriously doubt, though, that what they are teaching is anything remotely related to speed math. The other day I saw at a school math fair a 4th grader solve a division problem 4 numbers divided by 2 numbers. Frankly, the kid lost me 2 minutes into the problem and he was not close to being done. So I don’t know. When I see how our kids are being taught and compare them to Mexican kids(my only point of reference in actuality), well, simply put we are not hammering the basics any more.

      I’m really tempted in homeschooling. I’m pretty sure my wife can cover at home in 3 hours what the school is doing in 7 and do a better job.

    • OMG, I’ve noticed the same thing in my 1st grade daughter’s math homework that she brings home. She asks me for help, and I just look at the problem and think why the hell are they making simple addition and subtraction so complicated and redundant? Incidentally, my 6th grade son is in algebra, which I love, but I was unable to help him with his homework the other night because I couldn’t help him get the answer the way they wanted him to get it. It made no sense to me!! I could tell him how to get the right answer, but he had to show his work in a particular way that was just ridiculously complicated. I am SO ready to homeschool, but hubby is not on board 🙁 My children aren’t even in public school, but our diocese (Catholic school) has decided to use Common Core standards! Talk about boiling blood! Grrrrrrr…..

  5. Jack – I went to the Permaethos Zello meetup in late June and I live in Wisconsin. I’d love to see much of the PE gang again. I am a ’98 graduate of UW-Madison and taking the Permaethos PDC now and I’ve been in the MSB for a couple years now. I lived in Madison a total of 6 years and I know my way around SW WI. I was already planning on going to Mark’s Cidery that weekend as he is doing farm tours and opening the cidery to the public for the day/evening. I am happy to give you a proper tour of the area and run camera for you along with any other duties you deem necessary! It will give me an opportunity to sell you on why you’re going to start a PermaEthos farm in SW Wisconsin and why you’re going to hire me to help start it. 🙂

    If this isn’t possible, like I said I will be going to the Cidery that weekend anyway so a meetup anytime Thursday – Sunday is cool with me.

  6. BTW Jack, my teenage niece and nephew went with me to WV to the Zello meetup in late June. My nephew Tripp came back from that event with a particularly strong attraction to permaculture. He phoned in a question to you after the event asking about rapidly yielding livestock in a northern climate. You gratefully answered his question and sent him a copy of Mark Shepard’s book Restoration Agriculture. Thank you again for that.

    I see your trip to WI as a prime opportunity to further his knowledge and most importantly enthusiasm with all things permaculture. If you’d consider me for the job of your sidekick for the weekend I’d like to bring him along for the experience. Thanks again Jack!

  7. Jack, I live near viroqua, wi. I’m guessing that’s where hotel is for this weekend. Could be your camera man or just like to meet up sometime this weekend, hope you enjoy southwest Wisconsin.

  8. I see I need to listen to this as soon as my shift is done! I second david’s comments about the farm in sw wi. Walrus, my family is from crivits and I’m currently in Green Bay, if you are interested, hop on Zello sometime, there are a few of us in the area that are quite active. David, you’ll have to give me the cliff notes when I hop on Zello for my drive home.

  9. Also, as for Tripp, he was geeking out on permaculture and TSP the whole 12 hour car trip back from P.E. I’m sure that book meant a lot to him.

  10. And lastly, Jack, I met up with you in Des Moines but didn’t get to socialize too much, on account of the fussy 2 year old on my shoulder. Would be great to try again. And I’m handy with a camera too. (I really need to listen to this show!)

  11. I Enjoyed Andrew’s music. Roots/Americana style tunes are some of my favorite. Its incredibly tough for talented singer/songwriters to get their music heard these days or even turn a profit playing it. I think sharing his song craft with the TSP tribe was an awesome gesture on Jack’s Part. Was also stoked to see he’s coming to Texas in March. Mrs. Centex and I will look forward to seeing him in Houston!

  12. Hey Jack,

    Long-time listener, show guest, PDC member, born and raised in Madison, and now live about 30 miles West of Madison (Viola is ~100 miles NW of Madison). I’ve just finished Mark Shepard’s book and have been debating whether I’m going to keep my permaculture plans at the part-time five acres I’ve currently started or expand to full-time on a larger property. I would love the opportunity to go up to Mark’s place with you and would be happy to be the cameraman.

    I’d also like to showcase my property – some of the things I’ve done and things I’m planning. I’ll write you an email separately.

  13. In defense of my contention that proper border control would result in a spike in prices… my position is somewhat theoretical but based on the assumption that Jack will not be President of the United States at that time.

    A sudden loss of 12 million workers as they crossed the border back into Mexico would cause a rise in wages in the USA as employers scrambled to fill those positions with more expensive American workers or more likely with automation. Higher costs would be reflected in higher prices for goods and services.

    As Jack points out, this spike should work itself out quickly and if Jack were President of the USA, I would have no fear that this is exactly what would happen. However, I doubt that Jack or anyone like Jack would be President at the time. Thus there would be pressure on the government to “do something” and no certainty that the President would tell all those businesses to take a flying leap. Just the anticipation of the government doing something would delay businesses from making the hard decisions required to bring the chaos into stability quickly. Thus the chaos would be extended for more than a year… probably two… or eight years if a Democrat is in office.

    Capitalism is frightening for most people. It seems like stepping off a cliff and trusting that they will catch a branch on the way down. In fact that describes what most computer programmers do every day. ( Don’t tell anyone. They think we’re magicians or something. 🙂 ) It is also what every farmer does when he thrusts his hands into the soil and trusts that the fruit of his labors will be actual fruit. It’s either that or starvation.

    They ought to read “Wealth of Nations”.

    Alex Shrugged

    • There is a difference between labor and skilled labor. Assuming a magic wand could be waved to make all illegals disappear, I doubt the welfare cases would get off their butt to go pick strawberries in a field or lay roof in July in Texas? Second, I doubt they would do a good job at it? There would be a spike in prices and shortages in many services and food.

      Still, I’m of the opinion that the only way to end illegal immigration, without walls or silly immigration laws that don’t stop anyone, is to cut the welfare benefits to all able men and woman so as to force them to start taking the jobs that illegals take. Illegals, in a permaculturish way, are the symptom (much like weeds on a lawn) of a bigger problem but not necessarily the problem itself.

    • FYI… I’m a Mexican-American… a real one. Now they call us Hispanics which is a more general and useful term but when I grew up the proper term was Mexican-American. I am also an Orthodox Jew. (And I have a fever. I’m going to the doctor today. I hope it isn’t Ebola! 🙂 )

      My experience with illegal aliens is in the restaurant industry 30 years ago or more. They were hard workers then and good entrepreneurs… a joy to work with. Illegal immigration is a self-selection process. Those who have salable skills sell them where they can get the most money for them… which is a reasonable libertarian standard of conduct.

      When I was a kid growing up in a barrio there were welfare cases … mostly white women divorced and trying to get by. They lived better than we did WITHOUT welfare. My father said there were times when we nearly starved. I think he was exaggerating but it was clear he was fearful of running out of money to feed us so he worked a good full-time job for GTE as a lineman climbing poles. (He won the silver spike award! You never saw a prouder man. ) He also did custodial work on the weekends. When I was old enough (10 years old, or maybe a little older) I joined him waxing floors and cleaning toilets. It must have been hilarious watching a little kid manhandle that massive buffer but I gave it all I had.

      FYI, the reason illegal aliens are “illegal” is because of various laws passed in the early 1900s to prevent “the mongrelization of America,” I think they put it. I think they were the first eugenics laws… along with the forced sterilization of AMERICAN CITIZENS so be careful what you wish for folks. (That passed Supreme Court muster so don’t think our justice system is any protection for you.)

      I am all for border control and I like the idea of asking a potential immigrant what his health status is and even placing him under quarantine to be sure. I want to know what his prospects are for making a living in the USA and whether he is a criminal or not. Having a sponsor who is an American citizen and who would be financially responsible for him seems reasonable. I am not in favor of “Fortress America.”

      So… I don’t think that illegal aliens “on the dole” is our biggest problem. It’s AMERICANS WHO WANT FREE STUFF (or cheap stuff) that is our biggest problem. They won’t want those jobs that illegal aliens would free up under proper border control. Also employers would be required to provide benefits and that costs money so that is why those jobs would go to automation where it made sense.

      I agree with Jack that eventually, it’s all going to go the way of full-service gas station. Does anyone even remember what those were?


  14. Jack,
    Thanks for sharing Andrew’s music and taking me back to my early childhood. Originally from Beckley, W.Va. I can remember the damage from strip mining, the advisories on TV warning children to not touching blasting caps, the coal trains, etc.
    I haven’t been back since the late 90’s but verse 4 gave me chills.

    • I saw the interview of CDC Director Doctor Tom Frieden last night (2014-Oct-14) on the Kelly Files. He had fear in his eyes but nothing came out of his mouth but foolish pap. He is toeing the line and shoveling out propaganda. He made me nervous.

      The look in his eyes made me think he may have a conscience… or that he already knew that a second health worker had Ebola. He is probably afraid he’ll lose his job and become the whipping boy for this screw-up. He will deserve it not for this Ebola debacle but for the many other foolish things he’s done such as tobacco bans, limiting soda size, reducing trans-fats and other goofy things that are probably good advice but should never have been made into actual laws.


  15. While not ‘afraid’ of Ebola, I have some concerns for my wife who’s an RN at a hospital. She says the hospital hasn’t done ANYTHING AT ALL in preparation or training…. nothing even as little as a 5-minute briefing regarding the possibility of needing to treat a suspected Ebola infection, much less any actual training. And this is a hospital in a major metro area (Denver). I find I’m less concerned about a widespread, devastating epidemic, and more concerned about the hospital’s lack of timely preparedness and foresight exposing her (and also potentially our children and myself) to possible infection. Damn, even a couple hours of briefing on clues to look for and proper procedures would at least be SOMETHING. It is downright criminal to not offer reasonable (not total, but reasonable) protection and training to the employees that through the course of their job are susceptible to vastly increased risk. That said, I don’t think the hospital is deliberately being reckless, but its the nature of overly-complex and bureaucratic organizations such as her hospital (not to mention our government) to be slow and/or ineffectual in its response to unforeseen events.

    All I can say is I’m glad this isn’t something equivalent to a new Spanish Flu, otherwise I’d be begging her to quit.

    – Nick

    • Nick writes: “All I can say is I’m glad this isn’t something equivalent to a new Spanish Flu, otherwise I’d be begging her to quit.”

      This is a good dry run. My impression is that Ebola is less infectious than the Black Death. The difference between Ebola and the Black Death is that there is an actual cure for the Black Death. It won’t be pretty but it seems likely they could cure you of that.

      Is the Black Death in Denver?


      “As if worrying about Ebola escaping Africa wasn’t enough Bloomberg is reporting that a Denver man has contracted pneumonic plague.” — Bloomberg News, 2014-07-12.

      The “pneumonic plague” is the most contagious form of the plague, passed by droplets due to coughing or breathing the same air with them in a confined space. No fleas required.


      • If the response (or lack thereof) at my wife’s hospital and the CDC and government in general to this ‘dry run’ is what we can expect for a truly dangerous pandemic, we are well and truly f***ed. When it eventually happens I hope my wife isn’t still working as a nurse. She says as things are right now, patients frequently cough and sneeze on her without even attempting to cover their mouths or turn away. Some people are total pricks, and being sick doesn’t change that.

        • Ah HA! Someone gets it! The overall concern Ebola should cause, about a .1 out of 100 for the average person.

          The concern over how Ebola has shown how inept we are to handle something like this, that concern should be about a 80 of 100. Imagine if we get a truly contagious via airborne means deadly disease of any kind, even hitting 1-2% of our population. Well and truly screwed indeed!

      • Anyone that puts any faith in Mike Adams is making a massive mistake. The guy is a fraud in every way a person can be a fraud.

  16. Hi Jack, you should visit Devil’s Lake State Park in Baraboo if you can, which is about 25 miles NE of Madison. Absolutely beautiful, and the leaves will probably still be pretty! Coolest thing to do is hike the bluffs along the lake. Enjoy WI!!

  17. Sure, Jack come to the land of cheese and I will be out of town. I would of loved to have a brew and swap stories. Since I can’t buy you a beer do me a favor when you have a brew me it a Spotted Cow. The best beer in wisconsin. Have fun.

  18. Glenn Beck is also a fraud and huckster. The biggest Statist and Benedict Arnold around.

    • Well I am not sure what that has to do with this podcast/thread. I will say I think you are wrong and frankly dude you have no clue.

      I disagree with Beck on many things. I think he is addicted to the dichotomy and thinks republicans are the answer. I think some of his religious beliefs get in the way of common sense at times, etc.

      He is NOT a huckster and he is not a liar and he is NOT part of the main steam cabal. One can simply be wrong and believe they are right you know.

      I have actually met Glenn, spoke to him face to face, shook his hand and listened to him speak off the air when no cameras were on. He believes he is doing the right thing and is doing his best based on his beliefs. He just happens to be wrong about a lot of things.

      If he is a traitor to anyone it is main stream media, and we need more of those even if they only make it 50% of the way to the libertarian view.

  19. The 64 thousand dollar question is who much will ebola spread in the general population. We will have a better idea 3-6 months from now. If we resrict travel and those infected that do get thru only infect a few, all will be good. If they infect more than a few than it’s off to the races. The economic impact will likely be a bigger problem than the disease and we tend to go to extremes and expect everything to go perferct regardless of the cost. I am less optimistic of our economic stituation than most. The only thing holding things together is trust, our banking and financial situations are so unrealistic and ridiculous that its comical. Trade and travel will likely be recuded and who knows how well some of these things will cascade. Lower oil prices might help but will hurt in other ways, i.e., destablizing oil exporters and hurting financial balance sheets of shale oil and gas. Will be interesting.

  20. Regarding the music. Jack, I didn’t quite catch it if you said it, but have you never heard blue grass before especially from Appalachia? 99.999999% of Appalachia bluegrass is gut hitting reality about coal mining communities. It’s funny listening to bluegrass when you don’t know anything about it because you’re like “oh this is some real happy music”. Rarely. Very rarely. Certainly interesting to analyze and listen to music from different places because you get a deep window into what people in an area are REALLY paying attention to.

      • It would most certainly seemed to shock me the idea that you hadn’t (considering where you’re from). Every time I go back to Appalachia (of Virginia) it reminds me of it. You drive around to all these nestled small communities that are blowing away with the dusts of time from their former “glory”. My wife is from the area and bluegrass is certainly “her music”. I can appreciate it, but it doesn’t really speak to me and my experiences in life, even if my uncle was a professional banjo bluegrass player down in Arkansas, well I guess up in.

        Funny about Mark Shepard. I just got an email that up in Shreveport he’s doing a workshop. I’d say i’m probably 99.9999% going. Too close and cheap enough for me to make it.

        • I had heard of that fire before. Just crazy to think about.
          I try not to have too much of an opinion on the subject because its certainly one the most morally and ethically complicated discussions.

          I’m speaking about “mining or not to mine”. Any time we interact with our world we could/can/not uncommonly cause some major issues that can take a significantly long time to repair themselves (in non-geologic time). Even the most well meaning and “safety conscious” actions can fail. Down here in St Tammany parish they’re getting ready to vote on fracking and its a great example of the situation. The “funny” thing is, depending on your perspective you’ll have that scape goat of who to blame. The public blames the oil company (only the big contract winner) and the big oil company blames the sub-sub-sub-contractor who actually does the work and fails to do whatever it is they’re going to do properly. Just is what it is I guess.

          The geology reply is “it’s all meaningless anyways in the grand scale of time. Even the most destructive forces humans do and conjure will eventually be ‘healed’ over and moved on about.”

  21. Jack,

    Thanks for Your point about showing people these are not isolated incidents is exactly what I was hoping for.

    I was looking at the site and thinking it could even evolve into a search and rating system where people could look up the stupidest schools and school systems/districts. Of course this goes on everywhere, but if parents started to use the site as a resource, the motivation to “not make the site” could become very powerful to stupid administrators and school boards.

    I am even picturing a “heat map” of stupidity, wouldn’t that be something.

    Thanks Again.

    • Good point. Rather than JUST an outlet, could take it to that next level where people could also post and geolocate news stories.