Episode-1134- Understanding and Investing in Silver

Custom Medallions a Just One Option for the Silver Investor.

Custom Medallions a Just One Option for the Silver Investor.

I’ll promise right  up front that this will not be a TSPMint.com infomercial.  In fact I will spend the majority on the show on other types of silver, why silver is a great investment and why many “fears” and “concerns” with buying silver are not worth worrying about.

I also want to talk about the real and false reasons behind the recent drop in precious metals pricing.  There are two things going on here, prices should be coming down but not as far and not as fast as they are.  Just as speculation can drive up a commodity (especially when it is going up some via real market forces) so too can speculation drive a commodity down.

Additionally I want to really discuss why I suggest only 5-10% of your wealth in silver and gold and why I don’t recommend platinum and palladium in that number.  I will also discuss why I don’t recommend jewels or even really jewelry in that number, though jewelry can be one great way to increase metal holdings.

Join Me Today As We Discuss…

  • Why I focus on silver over gold
    • The delta still favors silver
    • Silver has many uses that use it up
    • Silver is the common man’s currency
    • Silver is more widely available and for now incurs less oversight
  • Types of silver and what makes each unique
    • Generic bars and rounds (ounce and fractional)
    • Custom medallions and pieces (ounce and fractional)
    • Collectable silver (numismatic, affinity, etc)
    • Bars (5 ounces and up)
    • American Silver Eagles
    • International Government Issued Silver (Aussie, Canadian, Mexican, etc.)
    • U.S. Pre 65 Silver Coinage (90%)
  • Methods of storing your silver
    • In slab floor safe
    • Fire proof safes
    • Private storage
    • Bank safety deposit box
    • Silver banking (why I don’t like it yet)
    • Paper silver
    • Buried in the ground (don’t do this!)
    • The multi cache method (a little of all)
  • Inventory and audit
    • Don’t think you know, know
    • Don’t think in dollars (it will make you happy and sad about nothing)
    • Do inventory types, not just ounces
    • Do photograph items in type stacks (for insurance)
    • Do update your inventory often
  • Final thoughts
    • If you don’t think you can afford silver right now you can’t
    • Take a balanced approach
    • This is not likely to make you rich, but it might, who knows
    • Selling silver is never as smart as trading it
    • Don’t worry about confiscation, really don’t do it

Resources for today’s show…

Remember to comment, chime in and tell us your thoughts, this podcast is one man’s opinion, not a lecture or sermon. Also please enter our listener appreciation contest and help spread the word about our show. Also remember you can call in your questions and comments to 866-65-THINK and you might hear yourself on the air.

52 Responses to Episode-1134- Understanding and Investing in Silver

  1. Is bella medical ministries on the ground? They’ve always seemed to be trustworthy.

    • Bella posted the following on their FB page:

      All of our prayers to those in OK dealing with the aftermath of such devastating storms.
      We are have been in contact with a church we’ve worked with in the past to offer material/supply assistance.
      We are unable to deploy personnel, but Ignite Church from Joplin, MO. will have our full support in their relief effort. They’ve BTDT after a tornado ripped apart their town 2 years ago tomorrow.
      More details to follow.
      Please keep all those effected and all the responders in your prayers.

  2. Brent Eamer

    When you recommend 5-10%, is that included in your net worth
    ie), If your pre-silver net worth is 350,000 do you ‘add’ 35,000 in silver, or do you take out 35,000 of your net worth and convert to silver?. I may be splitting hairs, but thought I would ask.

  3. Oh and Jack, I know you’ve been busy but I sent you a couple emails regarding the AgriTrue developer thing and I just wanted to know if you got them.

  4. Brent Eamer

    Oops, you answered my question at 1:13

  5. Jack, I am only 1 hour into today’s podcast, and I simply had to stop the podcast player and launch a comment. (This spot of just 1 hour into the podcast is the part where you are talking about securing your silver in some kind of safe or a cash box or a safety deposit box.)

    I am not 100% certain but I suspect I was robbed at some point between April 18 and May 12th. Specifically, I had a very cheap metal security box from Wal-Mart hidden under my bed, and it is now gone. Here’s an image of what that model of security box looked like.

    http://securityfiresafes.com/images/3030.jpg

    I am beside myself with anger. I think I know who did it (my landlord’s piece of shyte son with a criminal record for burglary). Inside that box I had a bunch of rolled coins and some pre-1964 dimes and quarters, and (here’s the really horrible part) I also had my original Social Security card, two copies of my birth certificate (one long form and one short form) and my US passport. (As well as my state issued certification for being a Massachusetts certified nursing assistant and my Red Cross certification for First Aid and my certification for CPR).

    I haven’t filed a police report yet because MAYBE when I did my taxes back in April, MAYBE when I was done with all the documents needed to do those taxes, MAYBE when I tidied up all the documents, it’s possible I relocated the security box from my bed to my storage locker and put it inside a bunch of boxes with all my other tax records. So I have to go and investigate the locker before I launch any accusations of the sort I can’t take back. But I am sick with anger and frustration over the possibility that I was robbed.

    I realize now after listening to your podcast today that under the bed was a stupid place. A security box of that sort of the kind which is locked tightly enough that a burglar can’t neatly pry it open, take what he wants, and then leave the rest because he will make too much noise vandalizing the thing open with tools and will also leave nasty scratches. So a burglar has no choice but to quietly take the whole thing so he can pry it open later in a more secluded place. And when he finds my documents inside it, maybe he will sell them or maybe he will throw them away. I don’t care about the coins. But those documents in the wrong hands can really screw up my life. The hatred I have for that young man right now (he’s a 19-year-old f-ck-up with an illegitimate child, no job, and I can hear through the walls his dad telling him every morning “Don’t forget to brush your teeth!” because he’s still not yet responsible enough to brush his teeth of his own volition) is a level of hatred incomparable to the hatred I have ever felt for anyone.

    I have a cop-friend on the Springfield Police Department and he told me to check the storage locker first before filing that report, but so it quick.

    Being robbed like this is the most helpless feeling. Once those things are gone, they are gone, and there is no getting them back again. The robbery can’t be undone. All you can do now is damage control, and that can prove very expensive and cost months or even years of your life.

    • I am reviewing my post right now, and it is rife with misspellings and typos. Sorry for that. I am just shaking with anger right now.

      • The New Mike

        We’ve been in the process of getting a good safe for awhile now, and we’re about as vulnerable as it can possibly get, so I can feel for you. We kind of have our asses way out in the wind and if we were robbed, phew, I don’t know what I would do. We would be royally, and I mean royally screwed.

        This topic was actually recently elevated to the most important item on our prep list and highest priority expenditure right now.

        • David Galloway

          I wonder if a medium-sized gun safe, one of the $300-1000 ones you can get at most big-box stores, would be a good middle ground. It’s too big for a thief to haul away unless he has a handtruck and you can store your other items inside too. Definitely not the best scenario, but if you have between $500-$2,500 you want to keep safe it might be a good idea until you can build up to a built-in safe and then you can put the small gun safe in another location to spread out your wealth.

  6. The real problem with a Bank safety deposit box is if someone dies who’s name is on the box it must be inventory and reported as part of the estate . It doesn’t matter that somebody else’s name is also on the box . The bank will not let anyone into the box without the courts rep. present.

  7. I still see silver spot price in a down trend. Looking for maybe $25 to be reached in order to break that trend.

  8. Such lovely weather we’ll be getting in the corner of North East Texas. It gets so at times, it would be easy to believe the weather forecasters exaggerate. Want to believe it’ll be fine, lots of rain, a little hail, a few broken branches, but not big deal. Then I get a call from a friend in California, please pack up your family and leave town, you don’t have a storm shelter.

    Not leaving town, but following the weather. Not heading out to our metal shop building. Not going on a camping trip, been there done that. (Kind of scary to wake up in the middle of the night in a tent because the storm feels wrong. As you wake up rest of the campers to follow you into the nearby concrete bathroom, feeling like an alarmist, you hear a sound sort of like a train, but not quite. Yep everyone run to the the bathroom now!!)

    In 2011 I remember one storm coming in, lots of warning, even the school kids came home a little, hospitals adding extra nurses and doctors to handle the injured, storm chasers in town. For most of town it was a non-event, we lost half a tree which smashed a fence. Lots of talk about how they over estimated the storm.

    Then that same storm hit Alabama and killed hundreds of people. That could have been us. I don’t know why we want to believe it won’t ever be us.

    • Modern Survival

      It appears that this is sort of just falling apart as far as origination goes over DFW. Looks like we will be fine here, I am still quite concerned for folks in eastern Texas, south west Arkansas and south east Oklahoma right now. God willing this thing will be a big old flop. You do have to take it seriously though when you have a torcon of a 6!

      • Tyronedeblanco

        Good luck to u all down there. I have family near Houston, in Austin, and port lavaca. Praying for you all and those in OK.

  9. I keep hearing that gold was never confiscated but Wikipedia has a few sources cited that say otherwise.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102#cite_note-12

  10. Great show, Jack!

  11. Gold was not confiscated, it was removed from circulation. As you spent gold the banks collected it and sent it to the treasury and it was replaced with a bank note. The Government in other words gave you a $20 note for you $20 gold coin. When this was completed they revalued gold at $37 an once for a nice profit on the exchange.

  12. Jack
    With family 1 mile from ground zero in Moore, OK yesterday was a very frightening day for all of us. Thankfully all are safe and accounted for.
    There is an organization that is currently on the ground feeding the survivors, first responders, etc., hot, healthy, good tasting meals. Mercy Chefs is the name. I received an email asking for help. I’ve pasted an excerpt from that email, though I’m sure you can imagine the overwhelming need. Mercy Chefs have been some of the first responders in West, Texas, as well as feeding people for weeks after Sandy. Here is the email:
    “Gary just arrived and he says the situation on the ground is even worse than what we are seeing on television. Conditions in Moore are, in his words, “catastrophic.” And more storms are threatening the area.
    Gary says Mercy Chefs will have six chefs on site today. The first Mercy Chefs mobile kitchen will be up and running this afternoon and a second kitchen will follow in a few days.”
    If anyone is interested, they can contribute to Mercy Chefs and help them feed people through mercychefs.com. We all know that a hot cup of coffee and a hot, nourishing meal helps immediately.
    Thanks to all TSP listeners for any help for the people in Oklahoma, through Mercy Chefs or some other organization.

    • Tyronedeblanco

      Jack, can you endorse these cooks? I’m looking to donate to someone to help, but I want as much as possible going to the people. I’m not saying these guys are not honest, but there is many scams / third parties taking money wrongfully.

  13. I donated to unitedway.org and Feed the Children of Oklahoma. Both guarantee that funds will be given to partners on the ground without any administrative fees taken out. I guess these charities have gotten the memos.

  14. I get that telling a fake silver coin isn’t rocket science (most of the time), but I’m surprised you downplay the existence of it in the 1 oz rounds and bars. Here is an entire site dedicated to it:
    http://www.wudacrafts.com.cn/productgrouplist-210049351-1/Silver_Products.html?isGallery=Y

    And a few gems:
    http://www.wudacrafts.com.cn/product/900514093-210049351/Andrew_Jackson_1_oz_999_Fine_Silver_Bullion_Round.html
    http://www.wudacrafts.com.cn/product/803494147-210049351/1_oz_999_Fine_Silver_Rounds_Buffalo_Design.html
    http://www.wudacrafts.com.cn/product/801243543-210049351/1_oz_APMEX_Silver_Bar.html
    http://www.wudacrafts.com.cn/product/733696189-210049351/One_Ounce_999_Fine_Silver_Coin.html

    No accounting for if they could do a passable job, but if Rob can mint silver for spot + 2.99, I don’t see why another mint couldn’t do spot + 2.99 on a plated counterfeit alloy.

    • Modern Survival

      If you are taken in by such a thing you deserve to be. Brass? Geez drop it on a table and listen to it. Not to mention it won’t look like silver either. I don’t downplay the existence of this stuff just the risk it represents.

      • Fair enough, and about what I think of it. If I get a chance, I’ll pull up an old YT vid of one of the better CF AEs that are floating around. If nothing else, it is good education.

  15. Jack, how to you feel about Pamp silver bullion? It seems to be a sort of affinity type but its format in sealed credit card style package and fractional forms seems to be good for barter.

    • JMO, but for what they are they carry a high premium (APMEX has them at $13 over spot of $22 – 59% mint premium). They also carry platinum which is about $70 over the spot of $1,451 which is a 5% mint premium. I haven’t purchased platinum myself, but I would favor it over gold, and would favor something with a reputable sealed assay, and that is where PAMP makes sense to me. For the silver, I’d rather just have an AE, or a LE / semi collectable round in an Airtite capsule. I wouldn’t put a 59% premium on PAMP silver in a barter transaction for example. If they had a real sexy design, I might own one or a few, but that is it. Again, JMO.

  16. Yeah its hard to get around that premium even on ebay. I think they might useful if bartering with a skeptical or uniformed person where the packaging and assay marks could validate the silver and give them confidence in the trade.

  17. Finished listening last night. I appreciate the information, opinions and encouragement. I just inventoried my small stash. To my pleasant surprise though, I have over 40 oz of silver and a few copper pieces as well. Not a fortune, but buying a couple here and there certainly has added up over a bit of time. I thought I had half that. I have probably 60% eagles, 35% junk and a couple of Canadians and bars. A couple more 1 oz bars are coming from Apmex which I bought off Ebay — the shipping was much cheaper. I really don’t factor in the shipping price in the cost of the silver as its $6+ for me to drive anywhere to buy anything, let alone silver. Its just the cost of doing business. I decided this when silver took the last dip and drove to a shop and they had nothing to sell. Wasted time and gas.

    I guess now I need to find a better hiding spot. A small fire safe will be available shortly. There is a tight corner in the basement shielded by a kitchen range. I’ll stash the box in the pickle crock with a box of girl unmentionables on top. :)

  18. Ronnie in Iowa

    UMCOR is a very good, safe source. I am Methodist and this is our world rescue sight. I am taking ‘flood buckets’ to the donation truck in Des Moines on June 8th during the annual conference. UMCOR helps people all over the world and we are now sending disaster relief to the tornado victims. Everything is heavily monitored and there is no illegal activity or misuse of money and donations.

  19. Jack, unfortunately i bought into the doom and gloom dollar is crashing fiasco a couple years ago and probably went in a bit too hard on gold and silver. Probably close to 30% of assets. Not that i think it will never happen but i dont see it for awhile. If it were you would you scale back, even at a bit of a loss and re-allocate to get down to the 10% range?

    • Since nobody replied to you, I’ll give you my two cents. Hell no! You haven’t lost a dime UNLESS you sell. Always remember that. Watch the videos from Greg Mannarino on YouTube if you’d like. If you have regrets now, think about the regrets you have when the dollar goes back down.

      Hope this helps.

  20. One way that I increase my silver holdings gradually is when I make a purchase at the local coin shop (using cash, of course), I will get as much of my change as possible in the form of 90% silver. They trust me enough to just plop in front of me a bag of mercury/Roosevelt dimes and let me pick what I want. Cool bunch of guys.

  21. When it comes to counterfeit coins, one other thing that American Eagles have going for them is that anybody who counterfeits an American Eagle is counterfeiting U.S. currency, so they are a target for the Secret Service.

    It’s kind of nice to know that the federal government is “working” for me by acting as a deterrent to counterfeiting the type of PM I prefer to hold.

    I’m sure anyone who is selling fake gold or silver coins is violating the law, but I am sure that the feds place a higher priority on nailing anyone who counterfeits any currency issued by the U.S. Mint, including American Eagles.

  22. I think it’s a good idea for everyone to get on the same page and call Pre 1965 coins by the correct name, and not call them “Pre 1964″. I don’t believe it is a trivial issue. For someone who is as respected as Jack to say that it’s ok to say “pre 1964″ instead of “pre 1965″, it adds legitimacy to a misnomer. I would say that would be equivalent to an English professor saying it’s ok to say “irregardless” and rationalizing it by saying “well, lots of people say it, so it’s ok”.

    If we teach people that are new to collecting coins that only pre 1964 coins are silver, we are doing them a disservice because they will think that only coins made before 1964 are silver.

    Not trying to be a troll, but this is NOT a trivial thing.

    • Modern Survival

      Okay well you not a troll but this is one of those nit picking pain in the ass bullshit things that if it bothers you something is wrong in your head as you are annoyed simply because the world doesn’t work the way you want it too.

      I am not an English teacher but I don’t give a flying shit if someone says irregardless, it isn’t important to me, I really don’t care. Nor should you. As always the merging of cultures and the youth will evolve language. Many words that didn’t exist in 1980 are in the dictionary today and many words from 250 years ago are no longer used. Spellings change, shit changes roll with it or you are going to be wasting fricken energy on bullshit that doesn’t matter. Unless you a professional writer or editor of course.

      On the pre 64 thing, as I said that IS THE TERM that is generally used because the COIN ACT OF 1964 (see the 1964 part?) is when the law changed the composition of the coins. So pre 64 is the INDUSTRY standard term referring to the date of the COINAGE ACT, get it? When people say pre 65 they are of course referring to the year of mintage, but that is NOT the industry standard term.

      By the way the spot price on them is simply called, “90% Silver US Coinage” because many 90% US coinage proofs are made every year and unless kept 100% in mint state, well they sell at the same spot price as any US 90% coin even if made last year.

      In the end it is the same damn shit and people know what you mean.

  23. I have a couple of questions based on your response.

    You stated “When people say pre 65 they are of course referring to the year of mintage, but that is NOT the industry standard term.”

    If pre 1965 is not the industry standard term, then why does the industry standard Red Book Guide Book of United States Coins use it to describe 90% silver coins? If it is not industry standard, why does Apmex use “pre 1965″ to describe 90% silver coins? Those were the first two places I checked, but I think two is enough to make the point here.

    Another thing you stated: “On the pre 64 thing, as I said that IS THE TERM that is generally used because the COIN ACT OF 1964 (see the 1964 part?)”

    No, I do not “see the 1964 part” because “Pre-1964″ is another way of saying “1963 and earlier”. It’s a non-inclusive term: it does not include the year 1964. Why would someone use “1963 and earlier” to describe an act of 1964? Essentially you are saying “The pre 1964 act of 1964″ or “The 1963 and earlier act of 1964″. Neither one makes a lick of sense.

    • Modern Survival

      Right now I am wasting key strokes, pixels and oxygen just to tell you that you are a assclown making a point no one but you gives a shit about, but I am doing it anyway. From now on I will always call them pre 64s just to piss you the hell off.

    • By the way, I just checked and it’s the U.S. Coinage act of 1965, not 1964. I don’t expect you to admit you are wrong. I do expect to be banned or to be insulted.

      • Modern Survival

        Actually I am wrong, this is still nit picking unimportant complete and totally pointless bullshit. You are not banned but you are tiresome and making a point no one but you cares about.

        Again pre anything is technically wrong as there are many 90% coins that were indeed made post 64 and 65. Now please go worry about something that matters. Perhaps take a trip to the national debt clock to get a clue about something this is actually an issue.

        • This will be my final post on the subject.

          Regarding the importance of the debt clock: when the debt bubble bursts, 90% silver will be extremely important to own. A large portion of my 90% silver is dated 1964, hence, my concern with people being told that it is not 90% silver. When you say only “pre 1964″ coins are 90% silver, that is exactly what you are saying.

          You stated “Again pre anything is technically wrong as there are many 90% coins that were indeed made post 64 and 65″

          You do realize that all of those 90% silver coins are still dated “1964″, right. So, saying “pre 1965″ would be correct. People go by the date stamped on the coin. That’s how the industry standard Red Book refers to them and how Apmex refers to them as well.

          All I asked is that you say “Pre 1965″. If you choose not to, that’s on you. I’ll say this: When someone once told me I was wrong to call magazines “clips”, I didn’t become defensive and hurl insults at that person and say it was trivial. I took it as constructive criticism and started calling them magazines.

          I’m still a fan of the show and will still continue to listen and learn.

        • Modern Survival

          No they were not! See this is what I am saying, they are making 90% proofs THIS YEAR right now.

          Again this is pointless, and wasteful of energy. People know what a silver quarter is, go pick a fight about clip vs. magazine or bitch about someone typing then vs. than, those are very important issues too for people who are so anal that they worry about correcting shit, while others DO SHIT!

        • And to think, I was just about to make fun of the clip vs magazine Nazis.

  24. hey jack,
    been a listener/lurker for 3 years. great show and great business you have built.

    just something i have noticed lately. you are starting to get a little crotchety (for lack of a better term) with some of the comments. with any expanding business/community there will be “newcomer” pains, please don’t lose the community identity you built in getting annoyed with the personalities of some of the noobs.

    another blog i keep up with is karl denniger’s (which i found from your podcast). he is incredibly smart but incredibly short tempered and often times mean to the people who visit his site. i would hate for you to trend too far in his direction. although, i do get why you often get frustrated with nitpickers who can’t see the forest from the trees.

    • Modern Survival

      Yea well spend a day in my email and see how you feel.

      • oh, i can imagine. i often just shake my head when listening to the call-in shows and read comments, just hate to see you wasting energy on morons. trust me, your words carry far more weight and authority, than people posting tit-for-tat comments. save your energy for the big fights.

      • That’s part of business asshole! This is why I stopped supporting the MSB, because of your whiney assed ‘if you only knew what it was like in my email”. You have done so much for the prepper community and you drive people off with your little pimpy assed put downs in the comments. This shows the real Jack Spirko.

        • Modern Survival

          Hey ed, screw off, why are you here if you feel that way?

        • Now that is an appropriate response and justified where your other comments to people like Scott and the numerous other people that have disagreed with you are inappropriate.

        • Modern Survival

          ed, how about you worry about yourself?

  25. I think this was the episode you mentioned TSP Copper currently being sold in eBay, and possibly coming back. Just an FYI for anybody that didn’t know, Free Lakota Silver still sells TSP Copper. In fact it is one of their cheapest rounds they sell. I bought 40 to use as challenge coins.

    http://www.freelakotasilver.com/content/tsp-copper-1-av-oz-999-copper